User talk:Francis Tyers/Archive7

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Warning! Inflammatory nationalist rhetoric may be removed at any time without notification.

... the third party's weapon is not a self loading rifle but his ability without force or threats to persuade both sides to avoid violence and settle their differences by peaceful means ... - The Peacekeeper's Handbook

To be unpopular with both sides at the same time is probably the best pointer to the fact that one is performing one's duties correctly and with impartiality. - The Peacekeeper's Handbook

I archive my talk page when it gets longer than is preferable. You should too!

Stop! Engage brain! Are you looking for the Macedonian Wikipedians' notice board?

Help please[edit]

Hello Francis, please help me with this article, it's not objective and it's not civil. At least pls let me know your opinion. See Turkification. Regards. --Gokhan 16:56, 25 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Re: Does Wikipedia Have Authority?[edit]

Thanks for your comment on my essay about Wikipedia's authority [1]. I responded on my user talk page [2]. - Connelly 20:23, 25 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Wikipedia Research Survey Request[edit]

Hello, I am a member of a research group at Palo Alto Research Center (formerly known as Xerox PARC) studying how conflicts occur and resolve on Wikipedia. Due to your experience in conflict resolution on Wikipedia (e.g., as a member of the Mediation Cabal) we’re extremely interested in your insights on this topic. We have a survey at which we are inviting a few selected Wikipedians to participate in, and we would be extremely appreciative if you would take the time to complete it. As a token of our gratitude, we would like to present you with a PARC research star upon completion. Thank you for your time.

Parc wiki researcher 00:02, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
PARC User Interface Research Group

The name is a non-issue. The research result will contain anonymized information. Thank you very much for your participation! Parc wiki researcher 02:25, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


No problem (about ignoring Tabib) :). I think its best though to delete his unhelpful comments altogether (just as you have done with Fadix)--you clearly see that he is poisoning the mediation process with his accusations and attacks. And by keeping reverting you on the talk page. You don't need to allow him to do it--I urge you to stick to your decision and move his comments up--right now, it's hard to find the 3 versions that we are working on, and to respond to them. They are completely buried in the midst of Tabib's diversions.--TigranTheGreat 01:13, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Francis. Could u please take a look in this article? Sections have been removed and tags added during the past 24 hours, without logical explanation. i cannot revert again, cause i don't wanna break the rule:p --Hectorian 01:26, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I think that the info and references provided in Hamshenis are more than enough for this section to stay.... Am I wrong? --Hectorian 01:36, 26 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi. Thank you for welcoming me in. I'll try to help improving pages on Tajik language as soon as I have a little moment. I tried to find out who were the Tajik contributors, but I did not succeed. I may not be familiar enough with the interface. FOA 12:26, 26 July 2006 (UTC).Reply[reply]

History of NK[edit]

Hi Francis. I would like to draw your attention to what’s going on with the History of Nagorno-Karabakh article. Eupator and Tigran persistently remove the reference added by me (Circular by colonel D. I. Shuttleworth of the British Command). I believe this is a deliberate attempt to suppress information that does not suit a certain POV. I don’t think it is OK by the rules to remove legitimate references, even if someone does not like them. I got blocked despite never breaking the 3RR rule, but I think the measures should be taken to prevent the references being removed from the article without any valid explanation. There will be no reason for edit wars then.

Also, the tags are being removed from the Sumgait Massacre article, despite the fact that the same Shahmuratian is used as a primary reference, and in addition to him a well-known pro-Armenian source Caroline Cox is being used too. Despite that, certain users claim that the article is neutral. I know you must be really tired of all these disputes, but would you mind to have a look at those articles? Thanks in advance. Grandmaster 06:39, 27 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Too bad I never saw this earlier. I fully responded to GM on the NK History page--it's pretty simple. The article already includes what the primary source document states--that an Azeri governor was appointed. What Tabib tried to add (and GM followed the lead) was to add POV interpretation that somehow this was a de-facto recognition of Azeri ownership, which is not contained in the British circular, and which is disputed by sources. Also, this is the very issue that we are trying to resolve on the NK page--and adding the whole section on the British appointment is like trying to jump the gun on the dispute.

As for Sumgait, Shahmuradyan is only used for the responses and statements of the Armenian side, and he is only one of many sources. This, again, has been extensively explained.--TigranTheGreat 08:09, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I know, I need to stop dragging my feet...[edit]

Ok, I finally started a rough outline of what I'm going to add to Anarchism in the United States like I said I would. It's currently quite bad, but here is the link. Tell others about it. The Ungovernable Force 07:45, 27 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Anarchism template[edit]

From Encarta: "Another branch of individualism was found in the United States and was far less radical. The American Benjamin Tucker (1854-1939) believed that maximum individual liberty would be assured where the free market was not hindered or controlled by the State and monopolies. The affairs of society would be governed by myriad voluntary societies and cooperatives, by, as he aptly put it, “un-terrified” Jeffersonian democrats, who believed in the least government possible. Since World War II this tradition has been reborn and modified in the United States as anarcho-capitalism or libertarianism." I think I have provided enough quotes and arguments here and on Template talk:Anarchism, which has gone a bit off-topic there now. If I do not see any coherent argument from you I'm going to change the template. Intangible 17:58, 27 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Where are those "Many sources" you are talking about? Intangible 18:35, 28 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Are you still going to respond, or not? Intangible 16:39, 29 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi There! Can you translate my name in what language you know please, and then post it Here. I would be very grateful if you do (if you know another language apart from English and the ones on my userpage please feel free to post it on) P.S. all th translations are in alpahbetical order so when you add one please put it in alpahbetical order according to the language. Thanks!!! Abdullah Geelah 15:57, 29 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The Borders[edit]

Hi, this is Andy123 from IRC. How's the work on the T-shirt going on? --Nearly Headless Nick 10:36, 30 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

T-shirt? What t-shirt? I think I might want one of these! The Ungovernable Force 05:33, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Rôle vs role[edit]

Hi Francis,

I've put an explanation of why I think "role", not "rôle", is the most appropriate spelling over on the Mixed Economy talk page. El T 13:35, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Why have you removed the link? It's not redundant you know. --Eliade 16:27, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I've made the link to function. See please if it is redirecting correct. Thanks. I mean "Multumesc" for you! --Eliade 16:37, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
OK, atunci prietene fii cuminte :) --Eliade 16:38, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Multumesc, stii tu pentru ce. Multumesc si pentru fixarea paginii. M-am chinuit vreo 10 minute cu ea. Esti tare! --Eliade 17:04, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Cand vrei sa vorbim online? Spune-mi :) --Eliade 17:30, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Multumesc si mai vb --Eliade 18:43, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Official request[edit]

Can you please protect my page so that is not a tool in hand of vandalisers until I solve my issues (RfC,...) with this bounch of vandals? Multumesc! --Eliade 18:50, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Bunch of vandals, against which you'll react violently? Quite stylish...   /FunkyFly.talk_  19:00, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Don't push it FunkyFLOCK--Eliade 19:04, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Fran, all the dispute is about the {{sockpuppet}} tag put by Khoikhoi, who grounded his suspicions very well at the request for checkuser page. If a version needs to be protected, it should be the one with the tag on. TodorBozhinov 19:15, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Don't make any new harassments, I will use them against you...--Eliade 19:17, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Hahahaha! Make some up, and use them as well. Might even be more believable.   /FunkyFly.talk_  19:18, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello! I started an RfC against User:TodorBozhinov, you should come and help me, since you were involved in the dispute Cheers,--Eliade 19:31, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Please stop this vandle with multiple user names and IP addresses[edit]

One, or perhaps two, people have been vandalizing the Beverly Hills High School article, and using personal insults against me and others.

Some of his usernames are: CH1; The MAN; Will Beback is a Nigger Faggot; AssMan2005; Skoda's Shlong; JAveline; and many others!

Some of these users have been disciplined or blocked indefinately, but he just keeps signing on with a new username!

Some of the IP addresses he uses are:;;;; amongst others. According to;

Some of these IP address are traceable to:

United States - California - Los Angeles - Rback26c.irvnca Reverse DNS:

and the rest are traceable to:

United States - New Jersey - Brigantine - Comcast Cable Communications Inc Reverse DNS:

A few of these IP addresses have been blacklisted, for whatever reason!

If you look at the history page of Beverly Hills High School you will see that this article is plagued with personal insults in the history page (and elseware) and vandalism. Sometimes the vandalism is a bigotted or racist remark, sometimes it is pornography. Many antivandal bots and human users have reverted these vandalisms over and over again. He has vandalized many other articles as well!

But he is clearly using dynamic IP addresses. There MUST be something wikipedia can do to block this guy indefinately!

Thanks in advance for your help!

Karmak 19:49, 31 July 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Template:Infobox Union[edit]

Hi Francis. Any chance that you're conversant in QIF syntax? I recently converted the Template:Infobox Union over from the old "hiddenStructure" style, but I seemed to have a small problem. Now there are several lines of white-space being produced at the top of articles using the box - but I have no idea why. Would you look at it sometime when you have a moment? (Or if that's not your forte, would you know anyone that I could ask?) Cheers. Chris --Bookandcoffee 00:34, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks for having a look. I'll ask at the 'pump. --Bookandcoffee 16:25, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The article wasn't deleted, as you may or may not have heard elsewhere, so I'm canvassing opinions for what to rename it to/merge it to on its relevant talk page. All reasonable suggestions will be entertained. BigHaz 10:49, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


You'll have to be more specific about what exactly is disputed and unverified, or I'll have to revert you, whenever my budget permits.   /FunkyFly.talk_  17:12, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Your decisions to merge the sections was not discussed. Why are you doing it?   /FunkyFly.talk_  18:36, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes, about that nationalism thing? Your sources?   /FunkyFly.talk_  18:42, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And btw, how is removing the region of Macedonia and ethnic Macedonians, replacing them with Macedonians an improvment?   /FunkyFly.talk_  18:47, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So since you "did not add it", were you blindly reverting then?   /FunkyFly.talk_  18:48, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The problem that I see is that you make accusations of incivility, while your majesty is allowed to curse. A role model?   /FunkyFly.talk_  18:49, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Gee whiz, I can quote you on saying "fuck" outside of your fuck the border thing. There's the blind revert, why dont you read the talk of the page? checking   /FunkyFly.talk_  19:09, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Accepted, so how about discussing changes, which you so much advocated earlier?   /FunkyFly.talk_  19:16, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So, are you going to remove the nationalists bit, or should we wait for about 24 hours and start reverting?   /FunkyFly.talk_  19:18, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ok, not bad. Two things, why is Bulgarian deleted from the list of languages in the beginning, and why is a stub template added at the bottom. The article is hardly a stub anymore.   /FunkyFly.talk_  19:28, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I've made some edits on Macedonism.--ElevatedStork 19:17, 1 August 2006 (UTC) ElevatedStork 19:34, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The source[edit]

Here it is Check art 3. Also, if you "inspect carefully the diff" you will find that there are four reverts in less than 24 hrs.   /FunkyFly.talk_  21:48, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

And? It is a question of taste and consensus if it should be added, and I dont believe so. Turkish btw does not have any legal use in Bulgaria.   /FunkyFly.talk_  21:59, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes well, that's why the policy reminds "When in doubt, do not revert". There is nothing restricting the usage of a previous version. Even so, there might be a fresher one. The user was warned on at least four occasions though.   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:05, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I would not be so sure about the claim that Bulgaria has much more minorities percentagewise than Britain. In the 2001 census there are 16% minorities, versus about 14 in the UK.   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:11, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
How about the Scottish people? About 8% of the population? Jamaicans? Pakistani and so on...   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:17, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I guess you should pose the same question for the Kurdish language in Turkey.   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:34, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Actually I dont care who asked you.   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:40, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Since you nonetheless revealed it - good for you.   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:44, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If this will stop you from pinging me indefinitely, I cant confirm or deny anything.   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:53, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Embarassed is not the right term. More like, being political.   /FunkyFly.talk_  23:00, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

A doubt[edit]

I wanted an advice from you as an expert admin: could an editor be legitimately blocked for excessive edit-warring even if he hasn't formally violated the 3RR? I know it would be a case of controversial block, but I wanted to know if it is judged a legitimate option, or something disapproved of by wikipedia rules and guidelines. Thanks for any advice you can give me. Ciao--Aldux 22:49, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hồ Chí Minh[edit]

Thank you for notifying me about that page. I am monitoring the page now, and have responded on the talk page. Again, thank you. --Ionius Mundus 23:20, 1 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The vandal of the BHHS article is back and is insulting you now![edit]

I believe User:WAterManof9176 is another sock puppet of CH1 aka The MAN, etc. He is a brand new user with three edits, and all of them are to vandalize my User page and my personal talk page, and to insult you! He put this on my user page: "Fuck you francistyers. You're no help at ALL!!! frm karmak the great homosexual drag queen extraordinaire."

He deserves to be blocked. Again, thank you so much for your help!

Did you known that Bulgaria was the most fervent and loyal communist state to the Soviet Union? All sources indicated so far that was a country that obeyed to Kremlin without any trace of dignity. It's interesting this history. I think I will search more material on this topic. --ElevatedStork 06:33, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

That Bulgarian communist officially wanted to join Soviet Union, see here: In 1968 Todor Zhivkov unoficially requested that Bulgaira join the Soviet Union as a Soviet Republic. --ElevatedStork 09:07, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Francis, honestly. Am I insightful or what? Apology?   /FunkyFly.talk_  15:30, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Apparently he is interested in a broader range of Balkan-related topics. I must admit I was not convinced it was Bonaparte all along though.   /FunkyFly.talk_  15:37, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Will add some chronology tomorrow, but it will concern mostly the KKE; it would be great if someone has information on the role of the USSR. Politis 15:56, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Better now?   /FunkyFly.talk_  16:44, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Btw AKeckarov is an expert in the subject matter.   /FunkyFly.talk_  17:15, 2 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks! Actually just translating... There is a lot, some very good classic books have been written, and I suspect most of the info coming from there... Cheers! Tazmaniacs 00:47, 3 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


You're welcome :-) - Myanw 19:44, 3 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

no problem-vandalism[edit]

any time ;) Wikipediarules2221 22:28, 3 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Look what's going on.   /FunkyFly.talk_  16:35, 4 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Seems to be back to normal.   /FunkyFly.talk_  17:39, 4 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

"Darth" deletion[edit]

Hope I'm not overstepping the bounds, but I copied it to his userspace (User:AZBigDog/sandbox1). I get a feeling he might turn out to be a good contributor. SB_Johnny | talk 00:45, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I noticed that you have deleted Joe Arpaio in response to my CSD for a history merge with Talk:Joe Arpaio/Temp. Its been over an hour and I noted the page hasn't reappeared. Is the history merge still in progress or has there been a whoops? -- ShinmaWa(talk) 01:09, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I've also added this to deletion review WP:AN, in case you can't get back to this in a while. Thanks Francis :) -- ShinmaWa(talk) 03:32, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks Francis! :) -- ShinmaWa(talk) 16:38, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

A technical question[edit]

Hi, I don't know much about computers or all the tools at an admin's disposal, but an anon was recently asking if I could clear their edit history for privacy reasons for them. I know as an admin you can delete user pages and such, but I don't know if you can do this (I doubt it). Anyway, they talked about it on my talk (under the titles DHS, DHS2, DHS3 and DHS4) and on their talk page. Thanks. The Ungovernable Force 09:35, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Thanks. Tchadienne 16:11, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

GFDL (Re:Here)[edit]

Thanks. Isn't this cut and paste edit violation of GFDL policy? -- Vision Thing -- 17:37, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I don't see logic in that. If "GFDL requires acknowledgement of all contributors" by cutting and pasting that acknowledgement is equally lost as with copying and pasting. -- Vision Thing -- 17:50, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


While I have not checked the edit history, this strongly resembles a continuation of the Macedonia dispute. Nineteenth and early twentieth century maps (the 1911 Britannica, for example) routinely divide Turkey-in-Europe into Macedonia, Thrace, Albania, and Epirus (and other regions while the Turks held them). None of these are the Ottoman administrative districts, which were much smaller. Septentrionalis 23:54, 5 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

While I regret having noticed this so late in the process, compare the editors concerned. My understanding of the state of affairs is in this edit; my source is the last, by William Miller. Septentrionalis 00:10, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'll see if Miller has anything, although he's mostly very oldfashioned diplomatic/parliamentary history. The problem with Wilkinson is that he's being correctly cited for a half-truth: Macedonia wasn't an Ottoman adminstrative unit; it was several Ottoman administrative units. Septentrionalis 00:41, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Hi, I just saw all this (Fran's talk, FAC talk, article talk, your talk, history template, article itself). I'm the one who copied all this from the M-(region) article. I must admit I haven't read Wilkinson, apart from the parts already included. Please, if you have the time, kindly copy some text that was left out in the article's talk, so that we include it.
Re history template, again, that was specificaly quoted by Wilkinson in the M-(region) article. Was Macedonia a constant stable well-defined "set of administrative units" as you said to Fran, or was it an arbitrary region until end 19th century, and after that it was defined to include the smaller units you have stated in the article? In any case, feel free to modify the "misleading" statement about "rarely used on maps", by enriching it with your additional info.
Finally, "Macedonia for the Macedonians" by Gladstone. To which "Macedonians" exactly does he refer to? To the regioners collectively? To the Greeks? To the contemporary ethnic ones? To the Blagoevgrad-ians? To the Aromanians? To the Albanians? Can you clarify that please?
Goin' fishin' now... I'll be back later to check... :NikoSilver: 13:53, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Duh! Moving that where it belongs...:NikoSilver: 15:04, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Goce Delchev[edit]

Why are you making blind reverts again? At least leave the ref!!   /FunkyFly.talk_  16:20, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

FYI regarding your research - Aleksandar Stamboliyski.   /FunkyFly.talk_  16:39, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Nice ISP you got :)   /FunkyFly.talk_  17:31, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Oh man, 512/256. I feel for you. Dont they offer optics in the UK already? The unique name is nice, but a little too revealing in my opinion. Dont think they do it in too many other countries.   /FunkyFly.talk_  17:40, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Is this 8Mb down, 512K up now you cite optical cable, dsl, vdsl, or cable tv internet? With optics accross the pond they go up to 30mbs/5mbs but it costs a fortune. 15 Mbps/2 Mbps is decent.   /FunkyFly.talk_  17:55, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Old Macedonian[edit]

The term "Old Macedonian" for Old Church Slavonic is mentioned in the major English-language handbooks for OCS, such as those by Lunt, Nandris, and Schmalstieg. Since Cyril and Methodius were from Thessaloniki in Greek Macedonia over a thousand years ago, the language they spoke was an old, Macedonian Slavonic language. Please do not remove sourced material. CRCulver 19:07, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I should mention that this term has nothing to do with the modern Republic of Macedonia and its language, and in fact the term in English-language scholarship predates 1945. CRCulver 19:07, 6 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Publically[edit] Why? --Guinnog 00:21, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I understand what you are saying here but I think publically is such a minority spelling, yet (was) so common here, that it is worth getting rid of it and standardising on publicly. Like humourous, or like connexion. Thanks for the nice thing you said. --Guinnog 00:34, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Please read[edit]

...and comment.

  • This: [3] is a text we should all carefully read and criticise before we start modifying the article. The link was provided by Politis, and I truncated some part of the address. Please read and comment. :NikoSilver: 15:30, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Mediation needed[edit]

Francis, I need your help. I feel that we need some sort of mediation over the Nakhichevan article (see the talk page for further information - in particular the sections over the Karki exclave). I want to have an accurate article and I want it done right. Please help if you can. Thanks! -- Clevelander 16:42, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks for your suggestion. I added my input, tell me what you think. -- Clevelander 17:18, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I added one more suggestion. Tell me what you think. Your input could resolve a key dispute. -- Clevelander 17:27, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I think I've finally got a solid resolution for the Karki situation. Any comments? -- Clevelander 17:52, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Vlad III the Impaler to Vlad III of Wallachia[edit]

hi Francis, i asked Bogdan Giusca to move the page Vlad III the Impaler to Vlad III of Moldavia, in order to be consistent with other articles about Rulers of States, like Stephen III of Moldavia, and he told me to ask you, as he is going to a vacation. The page Vlad III of Wallachia already exists, and it says an admin has to do the move, otherwise i would have moved the page. thx Criztu 20:47, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

About Cheese (drug)[edit]

Do we have any better sources for this, it reads like a hoax. - FrancisTyers · 20:08, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yep: WhisperToMe 21:20, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Read here. Just because it is sourced, does not mean authors agree, even now we know it is a thesis.   /FunkyFly.talk_  22:54, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Agreed as well, arent you watching the talk page as well?   /FunkyFly.talk_  23:07, 7 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Georgian quote[edit]

Francis, I do agree that the quality of the section could be improved with the rewording of some of the sentences. My problem is that I believe it is up to the editors to decide the best version, instead of automatically discarding offensive opinions--since there is no such rule in Wiki policies of NPOV. Thanks for your contributions.--TigranTheGreat 08:12, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Greek/Turkish placenames dispute, and Mywayyy[edit]

Hi Fran, could you perhaps check out User talk:Aldux# and give us your opinion? There's apparently a need for some centralised dispute resolution process over the issue of the inclusion of Greek/Turkish foreign placenames, both in Greek geographical articles like Kalymnos and Chios, and Turkish ones like Izmir and Trabzon. As you are experienced in setting up things like that (strawpolls and all), your input would be appreciated. In addition, there's the suggestion that Mywayyy ought to be allowed back to participate in such a process. You'll see on Aldux' page that he has promised to behave, and I had previously promised I would advocate a lifting of his block to offer him a chance of return in such a case. Maybe Aldux and you could arrange for an unblocking under some suitable conditions? Thanks, Fut.Perf. 11:35, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I do not understand why the Turkish appelations (or rather Greek name that are Turkified) should be included, even as co-equivalent in the opening line, unless there are key historical reasons (in which case the name goes to the historical section). In 'real life' the only place where the Turkified names are included are on some Turkish maps and can be seen as irridentist, but not on maps like that by the Turkish Ministry of Defence. To inlude them can be interpreted as unhelpful in our objectives as wikipedia informers. I stand by the same argument for the Turkish mainland placenames that originally had quite distinct Greek placenames. By historical reasons I mean places like Alexandroupoli, Adana, Izmir... Therefor the most agreeable thing would be to edit out the alternative appelation and included, if strictly necessary, in the historical section. Just for the record, if anyone disagrees, I would be interested in their arguments, which, hopefully, will make extensive references to existing works of scholarship, map making standards and general media representation. Politis 12:12, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I now notice that Mywayyy, still as (talk · contribs), has actually been continuing to make reverts at the very moment we were talking about unblocking him. I find this rather frustrating and would ask to impress it rather firmly on him that this is not going to be tolerated. Fut.Perf. 13:34, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
This is not a step towards solution. i was looking forward for a discussion on this issue, but as long as it is tittled like that and it includes only greek islands and cities, i am not going to participate, nor i will consider the outcome as valid. Would u consider a rename and expansion of it? --Hectorian 14:26, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


An Arbitration case in which you commented has been opened: Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Deir Yassin massacre. Please add evidence to the evidence sub-page, Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Deir Yassin massacre/Evidence. You may also contribute to the case on the workshop sub-page, Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Deir Yassin massacre/Workshop.

On behalf of the Arbitration Committee, --Tony Sidaway 13:20, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Nakhichevan again[edit]

You may want to check out the Nakhichevan talk page again. -- Clevelander 15:38, 8 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Check out the Nakhichevan page today. I added a revised version of the history. Be sure to respond with your feedback. -- Clevelander 14:58, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Check under the "Revised again" section on the Nakhichevan talk page. -- Clevelander 15:42, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
There's a bit of concern regarding a line I added to the Nakhichevan page. It's under my most recent post, please respond. -- Clevelander 19:27, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Are you online right now? —Khoikhoi 17:26, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Ah, I needed help with Bonaparte, but another admin already took care of it. Thanks anyways. —Khoikhoi 17:31, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Ahh, Bonaparte has IP from Italy dude. You don't know? -- 17:34, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
But he was on IRC when I logged in. :p —Khoikhoi 17:47, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sounds good! :) —Khoikhoi 17:54, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

There has been some pov editing there recently. I haven't read anything from Jensen yet though, so I've been pretty wary of editing it since I don't know enough about what he has said and what emphasis he places on some of the various topics discussed on the page. An anon claiming to be Jensen has left two messages on the talk page (and I think it's actually him, but I could be wrong). If you have read his stuff, could you try and check the page, the recent versions of it and the talk and try to see if it's npov or not? Thanks. The Ungovernable Force 20:25, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks. The Ungovernable Force 22:19, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Oh, and be sure to check out my new kitchen! The Ungovernable Force 22:20, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Disagreement at Category:Anarchism[edit]

Intangible is removing the "political movement" category, saying anarchism is only an ideology. See edit summaries and talk page. The Ungovernable Force 23:31, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Cuba photo[edit]

I think the photo looks great; I was planning on doing it myself. I'll make sure there is no trace of me in photos--I thought in that photo I wasn't particularly clear, and unfortunately in a late-night stupor I put my photography credit in the captions. This was before I knew Wikipedia's policy (and I agree with it). There are still some out there, I think. Thank you for the message. Could you give me feedback when you have a moment on the first article I created Tompkins Square Park Police Riot. I want to make sure I don't repeat any mistakes in future planned articles Second Avenue Marble Cemetary and St. Brigid's a 103-year-old historic church that allowed protesters to organize in Tompkins Square Park during the riot, which is now being demolished to make way for condos. Much appreciated! --DavidShankBone 11:35, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey Francis--No, I've never written anything about the Cuba experience. It's something worth considering. We stayed only with local people (in what they call "casa particulares") instead of hotels (whose money go to the government). I noted not many people disliked Castro, though that could just be a form of Stockholm Syndrome. Batista was as bloody and dictatorial as Castro, just not "Communist" nor anti-American. Castro was an idealist at the start--he brought electricity and education to the countryside; Cuba still has what many consider the finest eye doctors on the planet. But, I judge him harshly because he has ultimately created the exact same society as Batista had: an aristocracy that exists off a tourist class or Communist party connections. They just aren't landed. The US embargo plays a role in this, as well (a sign to me we have learned nothing about our hypocritical foreign policy since 9/11--why China but not Cuba? Answer: Florida). There is a lot of antipathy on the island for the people who left, generally the ones who profitted from the Batista era. Those people will not be welcomed back; that feeling is near-universal. The Mariel Boat Lift people are a different story. Some of the mansions in Havana rival anything you might see in Palm Beach. --DavidShankBone 18:34, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


I modified the photograph and added it back into the article. Is it ok now? - FrancisTyers · 10:51, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks Francis.--Zleitzen 13:58, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank you![edit]

ResearchStar.gif We've awarded you this PARC research star in recognition for your contribution to research about conflict in Wikipedia. Thank you for your help!!! --Parc wiki researcher 21:08, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Anonymous users[edit]

Francis, we've had quite a lot of issues with anonymous users of the type 62.162.1__.___ (probably a class B in the Republic) 62.162.19_.___ seems to be particularly active:

[4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10] [11] [12] [13] [14] [15] [16] [17] [18] [19] [20] [21] [22] [23] [24] [25] [26] [27] [28] [29] [30] [31] [32] [33] [34] [35] [36] [37] [38] [39] [40] [41] [42] [43] [44] [45] [46] [47] [48] [49] [50] [51] [52] [53] [54] [55] [56] [57] [58] [59] [60] [61] [62] [63] [64] [65] [66] [67] [68] [69] [70] (!!!) [71] [72] [73] [74] [75] [76] [77] [78] [79] [80] [81] [82] [83] [84] [85] [86] [87] [88] [89] [90] [91] [92] [93] [94] [95] [96] [97] [98] [99] [100] [101] [102] [103]

Can this range be blocked from editing unless from registered accounts? Or maybe only the affected articles be protected from anonymous edits from this range? There is also some evidence that a least part of these belong to user:Amacos and/or the indef blocked user:LBakraceski   /FunkyFly.talk_  23:51, 10 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Is it because of technical limitations that the range cannot be blocked? Other considerations?   /FunkyFly.talk_  16:03, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The full list will probably be about twice as big, if not more. And this is just from 62.162, there are other Macedonian subnets with similar edits. Should we keep reverting them one at a time whenever they replace "Bulgarian" with "Tatar" or "Macedonian"?   /FunkyFly.talk_  21:12, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
C'est la vie. Thanks for the card-blance.   /FunkyFly.talk_  21:39, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Putting the facts together: [104] [105] [106] [107]   /FunkyFly.talk_  18:25, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Montag evidence[edit]

Thanks for the comment. My contribution to the evidence page was actually a cut and paste of my original contribution to the RfA page. I recognize of course that it wasn't in the ideal format for an evidence page, but then I have my doubts as to whether I will be able to find the time and energy to massage it into a more appropriate format.

Anyhow, I've deleted it for the time being, but if I can't find the time over the next week or two to improve upon it, I'll just have to repost it again as is. So don't be suprised if it turns up again. Gatoclass 14:05, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


In early July you full protected Nagorno-Karabakh. I am trying to help Voice of All with unprotecting pages protected for a long time, and it feels like a month is long enough. I wanted to ask if it was alright to unprotect the page as I'm not quite sure what your summary meant for the protection. Cowman109Talk 19:13, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Alright then, I won't. :) Cowman109Talk 19:16, 12 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Geographic names[edit]

Hi Francis. Would you mind to have a look at Syunik (Zangezur) when you come back? Tigran persistently removes Azerbaijani spelling from that article, while insisting that the Armenian transliteration should be included in Nakhichevan. I know there’s a similar dispute here: Wikipedia:Naming conventions (Greek and Turkish named places), but we need to resolve a dispute with regard to Azeri and Armenian names. If it is OK to include Armenian names to Azerbaijani locations, why it is not OK to do the other way around? Your opinion would be appreciated. Thanks in advance. Grandmaster 08:34, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Syunik-- User:Grandmaster violating the rules of WP:POINT[edit]

Francis, I was actually going to write to you about this. As one can clearly see from the history of the article, I wasn't the one who first removed the Azeri spelling--User:Clevelander did, and rightly so: Syunik has never been part of Azerbaijan, has no Azeri population, and has never been an Azeri autonomy. As clearly seen from Grandmaster's edit summaries ("Why is this different from NAR? The rules don't say that other language spelling should be provided for automomies only." [108] and "Rules don't say that Nakhichevan should have Armenian name either. Leave it alone." [109] (!) ), he is clearly trying to make a point in retaliation to the Nakhichevan page, which is unacceptable and is a gross violation of the rules. I ask for your intervetion to stop this if he decides to pursue this.--TigranTheGreat 10:19, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'm simply adding relevant information to the article about Zangezur. The region had an Azeri majority, was under provisional administration of Azerbaijani government until it was transfered to Armenia by the Bolsheviks in 1920. The Azerbaijani name has as much relevance to this article, as the Armenian name to the article about Nakhichevan. This has nothing to do with WP:POINT, but rather is a part of larger dispute on naming issues. Grandmaster 10:31, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I am not going to debate the substantive merits of your arguments, which are clearly inaccurate. Trying to impose a "larger policy" on an article (under the cloak of "larger dispute") by adding something to one article, just because it appears on another article (clearly to your dissatisfaction) is the very definition of making a WP:POINT. You clearly realized this, which is why you tried to PREEMPTIVELY complain to an administrator before even discussing your changes. --TigranTheGreat 04:06, 20 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Article you might want to help with when you get back[edit]

I just created feminist anthropology. It's pretty short now, but I hope to get it up to snuff soon. You might want to contribute when you get back. And btw, have an awesome time! What are you doing there, fun, family, work, other? Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 10:56, 15 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey, I'm also trying to set up a wikiproject for anthropology, since I discovered there isn't one. If you're interested, you can sign up at our entry on the list of proposed projects, and on the temporary project page. Thanks. Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 20:56, 17 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

FAR of anarcho-capitalism[edit]

Hi, Fran. You might want to take a peek at the FAR of anarcho-capitalism, as they are closing the vote. --AaronS 18:08, 17 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply][edit]

Possibly, you could reconsider your opposing the The possibility of automated showing of Belarusian text in diff. orthographies is, by far, a myth. There are also significant and growing differences in lexics used, pointed out in meta discussion in request, and there exists nothing conceivable to handle them. Finally, there is talk on orthography, but diffs exist in syntax and morphology scopes, too

So far a myth, but doesn't mean it couldn't be done. - FrancisTyers · 22:24, 24 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Even admins of be-wiki say that it's impossible. It's not just an automation. There are no Wiki-projects that could solve this problem. 11:03, 25 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Be very careful before you state that something is "impossible", perhaps no-one has attempted it yet. - FrancisTyers · 11:11, 25 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
There WAS an attempt but it fails! (in Belarusian). That was a program that would do classic <-> official authomatic transmormation. But it DOESN'T WORK:\ Because the only possibility to do this is to have the DB of classic-official pairs of words with all the wordforms... It's impossible. And as an addition the "rules" of "transformation" are alogical because the spelling of classic words bases on the "tradition", not the rules (as in official Belarusian). Very pitty if you plan to vote against the official language of Belarus. That's the language that Belarusian people understand! Abd they don't understand and know that "classic" version. That situation is like if the "en"-wiki would be registered be "adepts" of Old-English and after the "adepts" of Modern English want to register the Wiki in their native language, some "Old-Englians" say: "You have your Wiki. Hey, men, what d'you want?" I think Bel-people have the right to write in their native lang in their native Wikipedia and shouldn't learn the "Old-Bel" lang... 11:25, 25 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Your analogy is flawed. Many kinds of English may be written on the en-wiki. I don't see why you think having a database is "impossible". It would surprise me if no-one at all could read the 5,000 or something articles that are written on the Belarusian Wikipedia. If you give me some concrete reasons why it is highly impractical I would like to see them. Perhaps you could give me Swadesh lists in both of the orthographies? - FrancisTyers · 13:56, 25 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Please read answers on your questions at:

Thanks! 08:26, 27 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Welcome back[edit]

Hope you had a good time! Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 22:27, 24 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


It's hard to say. I think the problems are (1) I don't think a literal translation makes sense and (2) there is a lot of regional variation in Spanish for a phrase like that.

I think que se joda la frontera is the most direct translation.

a la mierda con la frontera makes a lot of sense to me too. It's kind of like saying, "the hell with the border". But not polite.

Some of the other examples you have:

  • chinga la frontera (Mexico)
    I think que se chingue la frontera would be better. The way you have it, that's like directly telling someone to fuck the border. Or it could be simply "the border fucks."
  • putiar la frontera (Colombia)
    This is marked as Colombian and I don't know anything about Colombian Spanish. putiar may be related to the fact that puta means "whore". I've always known this verb as putear, with an E rather than an I. But anyway, since the verb is in the infinitive form that would be more like "fucking the border".
  • me cago en la frontera
    That's literally "I shit on the border".
  • Que li fotin a les fronteres
    That's not Spanish. It looks like Catalan? A "Castilianized" version of this might be que le jodan a las fronteras, "may they fuck the borders"

I should note that I am not a native speaker. But I think I have a pretty good sense for this.

Andyluciano 17:04, 25 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

How is knulla gränsen ? - FrancisTyers · 15:07, 25 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

That would be the literal translation, basically "have sexual intercourse with the border". "Knulla" isn't the versatile verb "fuck" is, and noone would ever say "knulla gränsen" - at least not in my parts of Sweden. Jobjörn (Talk ° contribs) 18:43, 26 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Why are you removing anarcho-capitalism from the anarchism section? There has been a consensus now for awhile to keep it there. There is afterall a "disputed" label on it, and that should probably not even be there. There are around 20 or 30 sources that say it is anarchism from reputable scholars. Please do not be disruptive. hot 18:49, 28 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey, I know you've been gone for a while, but could you look over the edits of some of the newer users on the anarchism page (and related pages) to see if you think any of them are socks. There have been numerous accusations, including some made by me against Whiskey Rebellion. Anyways, people accused include Whiskey Rebellion, DTC, That's Hot (the person above) and Blockader (accused by DTC and later others as a sock of Aaron). I'm also concerned by Whiskey's edits to Henry David Thoreau. They are using Goldman's quote calling him an anarchist as a source for labelling him an anarchist in the intro. There is discussion on the talk page. I have discussed the possible whiskey sock issue with Bunchofgrapes and Bishonen on their talk pages, but they seed unconvinced. That was a while ago though, and you're more familiar with that area and the possible indef-blocked users they could be. Other talk can be found on the accused socks' talk pages. Thanks. Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 06:30, 29 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Aaron posted to ANI. Take a look there. Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 23:25, 29 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Narcotics/drugs and the like[edit]

Hey Francis, glad to see you back from your vacation. I have a question regarding the Sumgait Massacre which directly relates to your knowledge on drugs and my aforementioned tidbit on the existence of it being present during the attacks. While not being given to the rioters per se, one Armenian couple reported that their three year old son was drugged by the mob. In the book that I used, it lists a medical report written by Azerbaijani doctors in the capital of Baku who treated and saved the boy's life. I was hoping you would be able to identify the drug and give me your opinion on it:

Name: Neresesyan, Christopher Garnikovich
Date of Admission: February 26, 1988
Date of Discharge: March 13, 1988
Clincial Diagnosis: Acute oral poisoning with psychotropic substances
Condition upon admission was serious. Stupor was alleviated, cries in response to noxious stimulus. Pupils equally round and reactive to light and accommodation...Child released in satisfactory condition, symptoms of acute poisoning passed. The child was discharged. There were no complications of infection.
Dept. Head: A. A. Ibragimov
Attending Physician: A. N. Bagirov

It may sound vague but perhaps you might be able to deduce what sort of classification of drugs belong to such symptoms. I'd appreciate it, thanks. --MarshallBagramyan 05:56, 29 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks, Francis. I do have some of their comments regarding their realization of what had happend to their child:

"Those men had yellow medicine [perhaps this was what you were talking about]. They said [the mob], 'Kida [Christopher] come here'...The man said 'I'll give you some candy'...And I said that's not candy [to his son], its yellow and round.' He said [the boy], 'No its candy,' and ate it right up.
...[the mother thinking aloud] How could he take medicine and eat it? He must have known that it was medicine. Maybe its my fault, we often bought the children vitamins from the pharmacy, yellow ones, white ones, Vitamin C, for their appetites, and they got used to taking them. Maybe the boy thought that's what they were, the color was probably the same."

Not sure how much that tells you but nevertheless, its on the yellow spectrum I suppose if I understand that part correctly.--MarshallBagramyan 17:10, 29 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Also, you want to come back to that page, we miss your presence ;) --MarshallBagramyan 17:38, 29 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Could you please check your email? Thanks. —Khoikhoi 23:52, 29 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Casualties of the Turkish-Kurdish conflict[edit]

Hey, the comment "In the Turkish-Kurdish conflict more than 30.000 [4] civilians have been killed by PKK militants since 1984" is a misinformation and link doesn't say same thing. 30,000 is total casuality (actual is more than 50,000) and most of them killed by Turkish goverment forces. This comment must deleted since it is not even matching with it's referenced news. --CalWikiUser 17:02, 30 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This case is now closed and the result has been published at the link above.

Eternal Equinox (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log) is placed on Probation and personal attack parole for one year.

Jim62sch (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · page moves · block user · block log) is cautioned to avoid teasing or taunting sensitive users.

For the Arbitration Committee. --Tony Sidaway 13:35, 30 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Francis, I think that the Syunik article is in need of mediation. Please assist. -- Clevelander 22:45, 30 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Fran, if you find some time, could you give a look at the edits made by a brand new, if promising, Bulgarian editor at the article? The editor has already started radical changes at this and other article; as a very new editor, who uses almost exclusively Slavic sources, Ihave difficulties giving an exact judgement of his work; and also, Macedonian linguistics has never been a field I knew much, while you're an expert. Ciao,--Aldux 22:56, 30 August 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey Francis, I'm quite new arround here, but anyway, I'd like to know that you have my support for defending (one of) my native language(s)! I know great deal about linguistics (especialy slavic) and if you have any question fell free to ask me, I'd very much like to answer it! PS: do not lose your temper with the Bulgarians, they are as stubborn as we Macedonians are ;-)! Profesorot 13:06, 2 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


I've just removed my own statements, is it ok? e104421

I removed them just before his last statements :) I'm just criticizing your statement that "do not remove "other" peoples comments from the talk page". As i wrote above i removed my own but i do not know that it is not necessary to do so in the discussion page.e104421

AaronS left[edit]

Got fed up and finally called it quits. Thought you might like to know. See his talk page if you want to know why. Ungovernable ForceThe Wiki Kitchen! 04:07, 1 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Neo-Tech spams cyberspace[edit]

Hi Francis, User:JoeMystical seems to be bent on trashing your -- and my -- cleanups to Neo-Tech (philosophy) and Integrated Management Associates. Please assist. Thanks! Bi 09:43, 1 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Dispute tiebreaker?[edit]

Hi Francis, I'm having two silly little disputes at Germanic languages and at Latin peoples. Seems we need a tie-breaker. Would you like to give us your opinion? Thanks. Fut.Perf. 17:12, 1 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Kurdish cities[edit]

Hello francis, hope you ok. Batman, Diyarbakir, Van, Şırnak, Dersim or Tunceli, Siirt, Urfa, Muş, Mardin, Malatya, Kars, igdir, Hakkari, Elazığ, Bitlis, Bingöl, Ardahan, Ağrı, Adıyaman. these are the most certain cities in Turkey that Kurds inhabit predominantly. I am sure Antep, Maras, Adana adn kayseri and many more have high population of Kurds but because of statistics it's incorrect for us to label it. Regards. Ozgur Gerilla 00:48, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Turkish - Kurdish
Diyarbakir = Amed
Tunceli = Dersim
Urfa = Riha
Bingol = Cewlik
Malatya = Meletî
Look at the articles if you can't find them inform me.
-Ozgur Gerilla 00:59, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Hi Francis, there's an article about that on the Kurdish Wikipedia, see ku:Lîsteya bajarên Kurdistanê. —Khoikhoi 01:06, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Well, if you see ku:Bajarên Komara Tirkiyê, another related article, it seems that it means "province", but then from the Kurdish language article it says it means city. I'm not sure! :( —Khoikhoi 01:24, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey - the first article just turned up in {{stub}} today. I noticed you created it, but when I went to categorize it, I found the second article. Could you decide which spelling to give precedence to and merge/redirect them? Thanks! Aelfthrytha 02:55, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


It's not WP:V. It's Wikipedia:Attack page (regarding the page that you deleted about Serbian expansionism). While you're interested in the Macedonian question - take a look at The Serbs and the Macedonian Question. It's Serbian POV - but the best comprehensive research on the Macedonian Question (by now), and it's as far NPOV as a pro-Serb opinion can get (pro-Serb orientated - but no claims over the Macedonian people's ethnic origin; AFAIC, it goes deep within its controversies with the Greeks and Bulgarians). --HolyRomanEmperor 11:57, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


It's not WP:V. It's Wikipedia:Attack page (regarding the page that you deleted about Serbian expansionism). While you're interested in the Macedonian question - take a look at The Serbs and the Macedonian Question. It's Serbian POV - but the best comprehensive research on the Macedonian Question (by now), and it's as far NPOV as a pro-Serb opinion can get (pro-Serb orientated - but no claims over the Macedonian people's ethnic origin; AFAIC, it goes deep within its controversies with the Greeks and Bulgarians). --HolyRomanEmperor 12:40, 3 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Too fast move, Francis. Are you sure you've done the right thing? Deleting the article "Serbian expansionist wars in 1990's"? What was wrong with it? Kubura 00:05, 4 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I did put parts of the text from "Yugoslav wars" into that article, because it needed some content, for the beginning.
Still, I was planning to add more material to the article (matter is large); War in Slovenia (Ten day war), Croatian War of Independence, Bosnian War, Kosovo war themselves alone do not explain the whole picture. Still, the "Yugoslav wars" article (that name isn't good, where is now "no original research" policy?), deals with war on the area of former Yugoslavia, but all these wars weren't the Serbian expansionist wars.
Or, if you want it that way, than there were also Yugoslav wars in 1940's, as part of WW2.
Certain user, known for its greterserbianism, complained about "anti-Serb POV" content on the talk page of the speedily deleted article. What did he wanted to say? That abovementioned wars weren't expansionist wars, and that Serbia hasn't started all these wars?
And you're listening to complaints of such user? BTW, that user besides is being criticised from Croatian, Bosniac and Albanian (Kosovar) users. It's not unusual if he used greaterserbianist sites as reference. You neglect that fact and you react to his complaints and obey to his wishes?
Speedy deletion? And you've bought it? Kubura 01:02, 4 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'll take that as an offense. Please define, what is "Greaterserbianism"? The abovementioned wars might've been expansionistic - but not just for the Serbian side(s). And no, Serbia hasn't started most of those wars. You forgot that I am criticized also by Serbian and Bulgarian users. Isn't it a little odd that I get only good revisions from Montenegrin, Greek and Macedonian users? Then again, I have received "positive rating" from the very few Albanian users that are right now put on trial (an arbitration) because of alleged trollish POV-pushing on the Kosovo article (Oh, Muse and Mary! I am only liked by the central Balccanalians! :). And, I mostly do good with all the administrators of the administrators of the Balkans and users that are of "mixed stock" (like myself). I think that this all tells more about you that me. :)

Francis, my apologees for using your talk page as a responce (will try to evade it in future!!!). Best regards. --HolyRomanEmperor 13:47, 11 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Francis, here's the material from the English House of Commons from November 1992 [110], where it has been said "...A third, Serbia, has rightly been refused recognition because of its naked aggression against others...". (and English diplomacy's been known for its pro-Serb attitudes!). If somebody doubts now about the fact that Serbia's wars in 1990's were expansionistic, let him read that line. Now you have the source. More will come, if you require. Sincerely, Kubura 22:04, 19 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

A Conservative politician? What does that mean? That that is the opinion of a member of some extremist party that wins 2.3% at elections?
What was the opinion of Margaret Thatcher, Francis? Do you know who Maggie Thatcher is? "Some conservative politician"? How did she defined Serbian aggression on Croatia and BiH? And what she proposed as solution? Do you remember? Or you were still in kindergarten then?
I leave Macedonian matters to my Macedonian friends, I have enough work with Croatian matters. Kubura 08:09, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply] know the drill! :-) •NikoSilver 10:49, 4 September 2006 (UTC) PS: What's up? Kinda lost you...Reply[reply]

AfD probably of interest to you[edit]

Francis, could you please take a look at this if you have a moment: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of common phrases in various languages (second nomination). The perspective of a linguist who compiles a list of how to say "Fuck the border" in 69 languages would be very helpful. Cheers, Kla'quot Sound 03:10, 6 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Good luck...[edit]

...on your dissertation! Hope it goes better than the paper for you know who's language! :-) And welcome back too! To complicate things, I think the Tajik WP should be in all three alphabets. Interesting, I can't believe I actually understood some words, reading a Persian-like language, in a Cyrillic script! Me, August is my favorite month. Sorry it had to end! :-( •NikoSilver 21:44, 7 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Maybe they should try the Greek alphabet to make them four. Hope you get that distinction too! PhD? I wish I had your patience with education! Didn't even go for masters. My egoistic part wanted it for self-confirmation. Thank God, the materialistic part doesn't regret it! The time not spent there was precious. Literaly. •NikoSilver 23:17, 7 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So you finished your thesis? Congrats! What was it about? - I'm finally starting the big rewrite and reorganisation of the Greek language articles I'd suggested couple of months ago. Looks like a big heap of work... Fut.Perf. 23:21, 7 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Re you like the new tables in Macedonia (terminology) or what? •NikoSilver 00:27, 8 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Well done Francis Tyers, M.Sc. :-) --   Avg    02:03, 8 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi, I remember you telling me that Irish is currently an official language of the EU (and you cited a source). According to Languages of the European Union though, it becomes official on New Year. So is it, or isn't it official now? --Telex 12:58, 10 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It is not official yet. See the arrangement I made at: Template:Official EU languages.--Michkalas 14:06, 10 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Help Mr.Academic[edit]

Do you have any access to any of these? I am sure they can remove the only remaining {fact} tag from our lovely article... •NikoSilver 12:49, 11 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Help Mr.Admin[edit] careful with the color this time, though! :-) BTW, did you check your mail? And, as it seems we have some more Macedonians around, your opinion on the last comments in that talk will be of value...•NikoSilver 15:25, 11 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Oooops! Check again tomorrow, sorry! •NikoSilver 15:30, 11 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Second opinion[edit]

go here

Organized labour stubs[edit]

Hi Francis. Previously you commented on the Wikipedia:Stub types for deletion/Log/2006/September/2 discussion about trade union stubs. That process has been closed and re-started at Wikipedia:Stub types for deletion/Log/2006/September/11. Cheers.--Bookandcoffee 18:06, 11 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Tajik grammar[edit]

Could you please explain to me the difference between "Tajik grammar" (whatever that may be) and normal Persian grammar, as being used in Iran and Afghanistan?!

You have simply copied certain words from a certain source. Yet, I guess you do not know that what you have written is exactly the same as in Persian proper.

The only difference is that you simply "translated" the cyrillic letters into latin letters, instead of using the normal latinized transliteration of perso-arabic script.

"Tajiki cyrillic transliteration" --> kitobho latinized transliteration of Perso-Arabic --> kitābhā

"Tajik grammar" --> man kitob-ro mekhonam (I read the book) Persian proper --> man kitāb-rā mikhānam

There is absolutely no difference ... the only differences may be certain pronounciations, which is very normal in every language (American pronounciation is sometimes totally different from Australian or Brittish pronounciations).

Tājik 11:41, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The problem is the transliteration you are using. The Persian language (including the Tajiki dialect) use both "o" and "ā". The "o" in Persian is pronounced like the "o" in English proper, for example like the "o" in "tomato". The word "kitāb" (book) does not have such a letter. The "ā" is pronounced like the "a" in "ball" or "dark" - it is different from "o". Basically, you have simply copied from a certain source which is wrong. I am a native Persian-speaker, and I speak the eatsren dialect which is popularly known as "Dari" or "Tajiki" - so you can trust me.
Many Tajiks nowdays use an "o" when "translating" from cyricllic script into the latin script, because in the cyricllic script, this "ā" sound is written as an "o". The Perso-Arabic script has its own special letter for this sound: آ. The correct transliteration of this letter into latin is "ā" and not "o".
Tājik 12:03, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
BTW: the transliteration I am using is also used in the Encyclopaedia Iranica, which is an authroitative source. Tājik 12:04, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Shomā lafse Tājiki-rā yād dārīd? Because if not, then you are not the right person to edit the article ... Tājik 16:25, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I am not interested in cyrillic script ... I am a native Tajik-speaker from Afghanistan, and I prefectly understand Tajiki persian. However replaces the Persian "ā" sound with an "o" has absolutely no idea of the Persian language. Claiming that "Tajiki grammar" is different from Persian proper - as spoken in Iran, Afghanistan, and other Persian-speaking communities - is totally ignorant. There are bigger differences between Bavarian and the dialects of Meklenburg-Vorpommern than between Tajiki-Persian and Tehrani-Persian ... I'll revert your changes as often as needed, for your changes contradict the authoritative Encyclopaedia Iranica. Tājik 23:39, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Maybe you should read (and listen to) this, and see what real experts have to say about this! Tājik 23:44, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Re, Re:Macedonia (terminology), I am thinking of adding some evidence of unofficial encouragement by the state. Namely schoolbooks, (prev. discussion here links from books here and here), and about governmental publications (prev. discussion here). I am thinking of smthng in addition to this paragraph of the article:

...that could continue like:

I'm not going bold before I discuss it. I'd hate to start (another) edit-war, so I am not posting it directly, but this sentence is sourced. Your opinion is of value. •NikoSilver 20:52, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I don't think it really adds to the article. Unless you can perhaps contextualise it more. - FrancisTyers · 23:24, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Well, my point is that there is nationalistic endorsement through the name confusion itself. That's WP:OR though, but I am sure that anyone with half a brain can figure it out! See, when your name and falsified history is purposely identical to a broader region, and you advertise to your youth (schoolbooks) and govt publications stuff about "only part being liberated" and sizable minorities, then rightfully your people will think of "lost-fatherlands". Especially when those fatherlands have conveniently matching names! So what it adds, is an explanation to the exact last sentence of note #3. Now how am I supposed to contextualise that? Put citations in GFM's quote to justify it? :-) (PS. Goodnight, and see you here tomorrow) •NikoSilver 23:40, 13 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So, what do you think? •NikoSilver 09:11, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

You're right, it sounds quite OR'y. You could say something like:

Schoolbooks and government publications in the Republic show the country as part of an unliberated whole. [1][2][3][4]

If of course the sources back that up. - FrancisTyers · 12:18, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

That constitutes indirect encouragement by definition. I'm sure that's not ORy. So how about my text above? •NikoSilver 12:24, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sorry, I should have said "Schoolbooks and government publications in the Republic have shown the country as part of an unliberated whole. [1][2][3][4]" - FrancisTyers · 12:37, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sure, ok. How about starting the sentence with "However..."? •NikoSilver 13:03, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Tajik grammar, FYI[edit]

I try to be polite, yet subtle when posting on debated talk pages, but if I wasn't very clear in my post on Talk:Tajik grammar concerning my position, it is that I'm fine with having two separate articles, and not fine with having an authoritative, I-know-what-I'm-talking-about-and-you-don't attitude (which you don't have :-) . –jonsafari 01:18, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

OK, I admit I have a hard time detecting humor and sarcasm in text format. I'm still not sure if you get my drift, so I'll just go right out and say it. I agree with your stance, and I was not calling upon you to act slightly more cooperative and humble. All of the references that I posted, and the vowel chart were to subtly nudge someone else, not you, to understand that 'o' and 'i' are in fact very common romanizations for Tajik. –jonsafari 23:21, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Please read Image_talk:Redcroatiamap.JPG and let me know what you think. --HolyRomanEmperor 15:48, 14 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Francis, could you take a look at the above page. Ultramarine has reinstated the material you removed on that page referring to a US report. I just find that the US material reads like a propaganda piece, is of little worth, is unreliable, obtrusive and detracts from the page. The US report was constructed for such a purpose a few years ago, Ultramarine believes very strongly in its inclusion and has been adding it around various pages for many months, but I believe it is a disruptive element and throws these pages totally off balance. I can't imagine how far an editor would get if they sprayed the US articles with criticisms by the Cuban government.--Zleitzen 14:50, 15 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The previous example was misleading. That "ro" doesn't mean "this" (it doesn't have any equivalent in English). The current example is fine (in terms of explaining the purpose of the '-ro'). If you want to use the previous Persian/Tajiki sentence, "kitob-ro khondam" means "I read the book" (not "this book"). In general, in a Persian/Tajiki sentence, "kitab" (without any determiner) means "the book" and "yak kitob" (or "kitobe") means "a book". Jahangard 19:54, 15 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Please comment. Greier 17:30, 16 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Our good old friend[edit]

Hogeye's back and making pov edits on the anarchism template. Can you keep an eye on it? Why isn't he indef blocked yet anyways? Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 18:53, 16 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Persian lexicon project[edit]

Thanks for checking out some of my old projects. I wrote up a fairly small machine-readable lexicon (~1300 words) for an undergraduate research grant related to a Persian morphology engine (Persian-PCKimmo), then decided to whip up a searchable and addable website frontend to it. It's all under a Free software license. I'm no lexicographer, as you can tell in the lexicon itself, and I haven't touched it lately. If you want to do anything to the lexicon, and/or the website frontend, by all means. Also, a native speaker living in Finland wrote a larger lexicon (also machine-readable), and he personally told me I'm free to incorporate it into my lexicon under a Free-software license, so that's also something worth checking out (website:[111], lexicon:[112]). I wouldn't mind working on it some more if there was some interest from other people, hint, hint. But if not, that's fine too.–jonsafari 03:55, 17 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'll check out your links, when I get a round tuit. As for the Riazati thing, I've only referenced it indirectly since I unfortunately haven't been able to get a copy of it. It's also been referenced by some papers associated with the Shiraz project [113]. Maybe someone from them (like Karine Megerdoomian) might have it if you can't get it directly from the Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology. As far as I know Karine and I are about the only ones actively working on computational Persian morphology. –jonsafari 18:20, 18 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The Lexicon Extraction Tool looks good. Do you have a Tajik paradigm file available? –jonsafari 19:54, 10 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Could use your help[edit]

Francis, you said if I ever needed your help, to give you a shout. I need your help: my Floyd Abrams articles have been nominated for deletion. I explain the point behind them on the deletion page, but if you think this is important information I could sure use someone backing me up. I have spent so many countless hours working on it, that if it's deleted I'll have to taken an extended vacation from contributing, because I think it is very important. I'm all for deleting useless and vanity-fuelled articles, but this man is living history, and I took it upon myself to do this (after I read the book he gave me when I went to take his photograph for Wikipedia). I am writing a grant-proposal around the project; if it's deleted, well, that would hurt me a lot. Part of the problem is that we sometimes have on WP people who do not know about the subject matter making decisions about it. Hence, the first comment on the deletion page, "Floyd Abrams seems sufficiently notable." To anyone who knows anything about Free Speech, that would be an incredible thing to say. --DavidShankBone 03:29, 18 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Good job[edit]

I got an edit conflict when I went to remove that personal info put on the page. You accidentaly took out some of my comments (including ones that were unrelated to the personal info) and so I put the ones that weren't tied to that back in. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 18:34, 19 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Also, watch Donnacha's talk and user pages, since I just removed warning templates placed there by that person. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 18:38, 19 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi Francis. I did a little work today on the WikiProject Organized Labour/Internationalisation page. I hope it’s something like what you had talked about. I’ve been thinking about how to do this and I wanted to run an idea past you.

I really like the “article summary” thing, and if there was support for it, I was thinking that it could actually be a sub-page (i.e. Trade unions/summary) that was transcluded into the main page. That way it would be really easy to access when it came time to translate pages. I would set up a page that kept track of which pages had summaries, and which languages it had been translated into (which could also be sub-pages (Trade unions/summary/Tajik) if that would help).

What do you think? I’m not sure about the sub-pages of sub-pages, that might be more complicated than needed, but I think the Trade unions/summary has potential.--Bookandcoffee 01:57, 21 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I agree about the sub-sub-page idea. It's one of those things that would get horribly messy and troublesome.
Think about the "/summary" sub-page idea for a day or two, then I'm probably going to bug you about it again. I like it because it makes the text transportable - and if we end up with a translation page for each language it's simple to keep the actual text of the summaries (or a link to it) on the page.
A table with proper names against translations sounds like a good straight-forward approach to me. It might be easier in the long run than a shorter list of translated keywords.--Bookandcoffee 03:00, 21 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Well, I'm going to boldly trundle ahead with some of this. I thought I'd set up the Wikipedia:WikiProject Organized Labour/Summaries page, and an {{Article summary}}. Once that's done I'll put up the Trade unions/Summary and comments on the talk pages to get people thinking about it. I know that two people don't really make a consensus, so I guess we should take this conversation back to the project page, but I wanted to get things started so there is something concrete to work with - otherwise it's like herding cats to get anything decided.
I don't think the List of trade unions is very complete (only 56 countries listed out of +180), I know I didn't add the union pages that I started. I wouldn't mind updating it, I'll put it on my list after starting the summary page.
I like your table structure. I hadn't thought about the "native name" issue. We'll be double translating a lot of names won't we... --Bookandcoffee 18:36, 22 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
OK, there's a start. When you have a few minutes take a look at Wikipedia:WikiProject Organized Labour/Summaries and {{Article summary}}. I haven't started the Trade unions/Summary yet - I thought I'd think about things for a day or two. There's an example of the tag working on one of my sandbox pages. --Bookandcoffee 21:02, 22 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I want your opinion in the last section (Wilkinson). Please read and comment. •NikoSilver 12:06, 21 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hogeye's anarchism trees[edit]

Hogeye has one of his trees on Individualist anarchism. I started a thread on the talk page and removed it (which he put back in) and I would appreciate your help. Thanks. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 04:53, 23 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Strike action[edit]

I got it. There needed to be a colon before the {{FULLNAME}} when it was inside the article namespace so it didn't go looking for an actual template to call...--Bookandcoffee 09:29, 23 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey, no big rush, but I wrote a note to put on the project talk page about the Internationalisation and Summary pages. It has your name in it, so I didn't want to post it without getting you to look at it. User:Bookandcoffee/Sandbox. Does that sound reasonable?--Bookandcoffee 17:00, 23 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That's funny - that's exactly who came to my mind as well. I'll drop him a line.--Bookandcoffee 17:08, 23 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


dude, lighten up. Parsecboy 16:49, 23 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


I guess it's on. Thanks for not warning me. I seem to have returned the favor.   /FunkyFly.talk_  21:36, 23 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


I would appreciate your feedback at Image talk:Food Not Bombs logo.png. Also see User talk:Nv8200p#Image:Food Not Bombs logo.png for more info. Thanks. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 22:49, 23 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

User notice: temporary 3RR block[edit]

You have been temporarily blocked for violation of the three-revert rule. Please feel free to return after the block expires, but also please make an effort to discuss your changes further in the future.
The duration of the block is 24 hours. William M. Connolley 08:19, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Ouch, that was a close call. Even I had no idea that version pre-existed. I was asleep when all of that happened. Now why on earth did FF and you have to bring all this to that point? I guess we have to be really carefull with all previous versions when we engage in this sort of s***. OTOH, I kinda understand FF, as I'm sure that he was aware of that version and had calculated that you'd be unable to revert him after his third one. I hope you and FF will manage to put that behind you. •NikoSilver 11:44, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

One of those reverts is actually an edit [115]. If I were Francis I'd remove that block on my own, it's clearly abused. Miskin 23:08, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

NO Fran, NO, don't please...[edit]

Please take that back. :-( You'll make me suffer from endless insomnia! •NikoSilver 19:13, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I certainly don't intend to "leave". :) - FrancisTyers · 19:47, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You needn't take that so heavily. It was a close call. You deserve being an admin more than some other admins I've seen that try to hang on their adminship. On a lighter note, I'm glad that you don't intend to leave; especially now with my insomnia... I need someone to talk to every now and then! •NikoSilver 19:55, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
If I can add my voice to that of Niko, please, please PLEASE don't cease being an admin! The Balkans and the similar problematic areas you cover need an admin that knows what they're speaking about, and you know how few the admins covering the area are, especially as good as you! Please, don't take hasty decisions.--Aldux 20:34, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I don't know if it's too early, but I'm sure you'll have to put one of those little machines with the precedence numbers they have in banks and supermarkets for this, so I decided to announce it right now: Despite the fact that we've confronted each other often, I'm re-nominating you in the next few days. Now shut up and don't argue with me on this! :-) •NikoSilver 20:53, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Well, you're always free to do what you want, but I really don't think you should do this if your only reason was that 3RR. Everyone overlooks things sometimes, and you are a definitely needed to block wolfstar socks on anarchism. Oh well, do what you want, but I personally would prefer that you not do this. Oh, btw, I talked to Keith McHenry today over the phone, who is one of the original founders of Food Not Bombs and created the logo. It's free for anyone to use, I just need to find out how to confirm it here on wiki, since my word probably isn't good enough. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 01:40, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hey, what's going on here? All the place gone crazy suddenly? People desysopping themselves over Macedonia-related sillinesses, of all things? Please do tell me you're not going to go through with this. Fut.Perf. 10:42, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks for your kind words on my RfA, but I'm not here because of that. Even if I occassionally accused you for WP:POINTitis, you really really went too far this time. Like Niko said, we can keep on renominating you until the things get back to the status quo (fulfilling our part of WP:POINT :-) ). Duja 12:20, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Speaking of points, I was in Berlin yesterday, and I certainly would have climbed the Reichstag in protest, with or without my Spiderman costume, had I known what was going on here. What else can I do now to get my point across? Oh wait... how about edit-warring on Macedonia until I get myself blocked too? I have half a mind to... Fut.Perf. 12:47, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Man, I'll tell you what: We all revert each-other and then report each-other to lose our block virginities. That will make you feel better; won't it? PS: See User talk:Pmanderson#Hi Sept and comment about the map.•NikoSilver 16:23, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
LOL! :D I'll take a look at that now. - FrancisTyers · 17:06, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
An alternate approach is that Francis proposes both of you for adminship. In this way, you will also be able to take admin advantages in the edit dispute, and your eventual climbing the Reichstag in Spiderman suit will carry more weight. Besides, you will be able to block each other without outsiders' involvement. Duja 19:15, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Francis, revoke the jebeni de-sysop request and get some sleep. Pardon my serbo-croatian. BTW, checkout my userpage if you think the people here are not mad enough to nominate you for adminship once a week. --Dijxtra 22:12, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Transnistria needs you[edit]

Francis, we have a problem which we can't solve on Transnistria. It is a play-by-play copy of the exact same problem which we had there 6 months ago, and it involves the same main character. You were the only one who helped us solve us, and since then, we had peace for 6 months. See your action here [[116]]. I tried to do the exact same thing[117], and explain why, but since I am a party to the conflict it was not seen as a constructive edit but was immediately reverted just minutes later; quite predictably. I am therefore asking you to please come back and do a repeat of your 11 March masterstroke. I fear that this is the only way we can bring consensus, just as before, because the same person is involved with the exact same modus operandi. - Mauco 23:53, 24 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


I mean, I was flabbergasted. I don't think I've made a single template edit other than vandal-fighting... The Land 13:17, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

What's going on?[edit]

You're an administrator. A 3RR block, even heavier accusations of Macedonism - what has being going on with you lately, Franics??? --HolyRomanEmperor 18:01, 25 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Unprompted advise[edit]

Hi Francis, I have been around for just over a year. We have only met a few times, so I canot really say I know you well. In any case, I would like to ask you to reconsider your position. If you are thinking that you may have got drawned into edit wars or got far too involved on an issue, why do not you try leaving it aside for a while instead asking to be de-sysoped? Personally I think it makes more sense and you can prove yourself you are level-headed. I believe that wikipedia will still benefit from your presence either as an admin or a normal editor but I do not think there is a reason for wanting to stop being an admin. You have proved yourself in the past. Well, these are my two pences. Have a nice day, Asteriontalk 07:10, 26 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hello, Francis Tyers, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and someone will show up shortly to answer your questions. Again, welcome!  •NikoSilver 11:00, 27 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

To follow up on the free advice given by Niko, let me point out here that it is generally regarded as highly inappropriate for newbies with less than 500 (or even less than 5!) edits to run for adminship. So, don't you dare. But do give me a call if anybody should attempt to bite you. Again, welcome to Wikipedia! Fut.Perf. 11:08, 27 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Oh mate! Welcome back! -- Szvest 11:16, 27 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I want my dang T-shirt. And join us in #wikipedia. >:(Nearly Headless Nick {L} 11:18, 27 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Nuvola apps kdmconfig.png It is suspected that this user might be a sock puppet or impersonator of FrancisTyers.
Please refer to contributions for evidence. See block log and current autoblocks.

Huh? "rm cats"? Why did you "remove the cats"? [118] Fut.Perf. 11:33, 27 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This article needs more cats.

Please help Wikipedia by adding more cats to articles, especially this one.

My bad, sorry. I'll readd them: Duja 11:42, 27 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I've been trying to locate the scientific term, but there doesn't seem to be any Category:Users with block-virginity sewn. :-) •NikoSilver 11:40, 27 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
And here's what I get for joining the Category:Wikipedians not wanting Francis to be desysoped campaign: [119]. At least you can't say we aren't prepared to suffer for our convictions. Fut.Perf. 14:59, 28 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Eh, seriously now, there's not much sense us putting you up for RFA, as long as all you need to do to become an admin again is to just say the word (new account or no new account). So, simple question: how many of us do you want to sign the petition before you say it? Fut.Perf. 15:30, 28 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Changing your username[edit]

Hi. We have been informed that you might want to change your username (here). In order to have your contributions reassigned to your desired new name, you need to post a request at WP:CHU. Follow the instructions at the top of the page, and a Bureaucrat will go over your request. Cheers, Redux 01:15, 28 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yes, currently it is not possible for Bureaucrats to merge edits made from different accounts, or reassign edits made anonymously (that have been assigned to an IP address). We can only rename existing accounts to a new name that is not taken in the database. You appear to have made only a handful of edits from the IP address though, so perhaps a simple note on the IP's talk page identifying it as yours would suffice -- and you can still have your account renamed, so that all the edits assigned to this account will be reassigned to your new username. The only thing you could try to do, although I anticipate it would be difficult to get someone to do it, is try to contact a developer -- Developers have the ability to merge edits and reassign edits from IP addresses by editing the database directly; in fact we used to have a forum for such requests, but the service has been discontinued. Redux 15:54, 28 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Oh, both names already exist as separate accounts? That would pose a problem for a rename. As I mentioned, we can only rename to a name that is not taken in the database. If you would like to have the edits of one of them reassigned to the other, and being that you control both, you need to post with both accounts at WP:CHU, requesting that one of them be renamed to something else, in order to free that name in the database. Then it will be possible to rename the other account to that other name. Or you may forgo a rename altogether, if you just prefer to stick to present state of affairs.
If you prefer to keep editing with both, it is advisible to disclose one of the accounts as being a legal sockpuppet of the other account, or it may end up blocked for impersonation, or sockpuppetry. Generally, it's best to have only one account, unless you have a need for a second one (see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet). Redux 16:10, 28 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

List of trade unions[edit]

So the List of trade unions is now updated if you still wanted to use it for your translation list. It also has a number of red-link names in it, I don't know if that affects your plans or not. Just as a thought, would using Infobox Union - what links here provide a cross-reference for which pages have usable info?--Bookandcoffee 01:53, 28 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I noted that you indicated interest in joining this project as a proposed project. I thought you'd like to know that it is now active, and is at the page above. Maybe you'd like to sign on there. As it is active, it's being removed from the list of proposed projects. Badbilltucker 23:50, 28 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Articles by Tantug et al.[edit]

Was that you on #wikipedia just now? This URL has publicly available papers though not the exact one you asked about. EdJohnston 17:11, 29 September 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Virginity huh?[edit]

Happy now? :-) •NikoSilver 14:52, 2 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi, what do you think of the following quotes from the text:

  • In the last hundred years, four Eastern Anatolian groups—Armenians, Kurds, Assyrians, and Greeks—have fallen victim to state-sponsored attempts by the Ottoman authorities or their Turkish or Iraqi successors to eradicate them. Because of space limitations, I have concentrated here on the genocidal sequence affecting Armenians and Kurds only, though my approach would also be pertinent to the Pontic Greek and Assyrian cases.
  • By ridding themselves of the Armenians, Greeks, or any other group that stood in their way, Turkish nationalists were attempting to prove how they could clarify, purify, and ultimately unify a polity and society so that it could succeed on its own, albeit Western-orientated terms. This, of course, was the ultimate paradox: the CUP committed genocide in order to transform the residual empire into a streamlined, homogeneous nation-state on the European model.

Now I can't access that PDF easily now (it's a large file and I'm on a 44 kbit/sec connection at the moment), so if you want to say something to me, you'll have to quote it. I got the extracts above from the article's talkpage. --Tzekai 17:07, 3 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Losing my patience[edit]

Francis, i'm losing my patience with the way things are going in Pontian article. Every source we provide is criticsed in any way possible i.e. "non-explicit", using a book review of Midlarsky to say he is "genocide tolerant"!, asking for Mazower to be removed, saying Levene "is ours" etc. This article will get nowhere. Are they even going to attempt to explain how these events unfolded? No because they cant. There simply is not enough research for them to build a credible article from, so the whole article has degenerated into a "this author says genocide, this author dosnt say genocide but maybe means it, and this country says genocide" etc etc Ok, but is anyone going to explain how, who, where and what on earth happened to these Pontians, or are we going to shout genocide all day...

Some of the same editors have gone over to the Pan-Turkism article, and asked that i provide sources that Turkish Cypriots can understand Turks from Turkey! What kind of task is this? I told them i am Turkish Cypriot, and i understand, they basically said i have to get a source to prove i understand! Its becoming a farce, it seems no one is interested in creating an article, only in making a nationalist point. I'd appreciate if you could keep an eye on the article, at least both sides of the dispute agree we can only really solve this with a third party around. Thanks, --A.Garnet 17:43, 4 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

You have to give an article time to improve. All you seem to care about is the title, and once that's changes, you'll probably ditch the article and not care less what becomes of it (in other words, it seems that you're pushing an agenda, not trying to improve the article). I think the article has significantly improved over today since it was unblocked, and I think a fully detailed account of what happened to the Pontians can be drawn from the reports of the NGOs who have dealt with the topic, namely the International League for the Rights and Liberation of Peoples and the Australian Institute for Holocaust and Genocide Studies. You criticize sources a lot too, you know, criticizing how academic each source etc.
What we're trying to do now, is sort out the title, something which seems to be your top (and only) priority. If you drop the title issue for now, and let everyone deal with the history of the events (and maybe participate yourself a little if you honestly care about the article explaining how these events unfolded). One thing at a time, you address the title issue, and once everyone else does, you complain no one's doing anything to the rest of the article!
As for Turkish Cypriot, as I've said, that passage is sourced, and extremely likely. Cypriot Greek is largely incomprehensible to speakers of Yunanistan Rumcası.--Tekleni 18:29, 4 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

No remark #3 here[edit] I suppose I can ask: Did you receive the e-mails I sent you?•NikoSilver 19:15, 5 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Maraba Photo[edit]

Hi Francis,

I'm trying to work on your comments about the photo but am having trouble eliminating the white glare from the glossy black surface. Would you recomment using sunlight or room light to achieve the effect, and is there anything I can adjust on my digital camera (a Canon Ixus), or post-editing I can do to improve matters? Cheers — SteveRwanda 16:23, 6 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Francis, I've reached the point where I just can't deal with editor Ultramarine - without blowing a gasket. I have dealt with this editor on a number of other pages leaving what were formerly decent pages now unsatisfactory, unclear, poorly presented and usually with a POV tag on the top. The editor can only seemingly edit through one narrow point of view, provides minimal communication when making large scale edits, has a completely one-sided view of the editing process (will question a source he/she doesn't like to it's minutae whilst willfully adding unsourced original research elsewhere [120]), refuses to abide by referencing formats, and seems unable to get a perspective on how to actually present information. Thing is, I'm not going anywhere, and will still be editing on wikipedia and that page for the foreseeable future. But I quite simply cannot communicate with this editor. Either I'm wrong on this - and I've been accused of bias from both sides of the Cuban debate whilst making my 2000+ edits on Cuban subjects see here and here - or Ultramarine is wrong. Reading this rfc and this arbitration where I see a familiar pattern - I think it is Ultramarine's approach that is wrong. To avoid things turning nasty, I could badly do with some external input into the page. Because judging by Ultramarine's previous form and lack of communication - a drip-drip edit war could go on for a long time.--Zleitzen 02:00, 9 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Opinion needed[edit]

Hey, there is a bit of an edit war going on in the external links section of The World Can't Wait and Revolutionary Communist Party, USA. The talk pages of each include the relevant info (although posts keep getting removed, so you may need to look in the history. It seems to me that User:In the Stacks has an axe to grind with Chuck Munson (which appears to be mutual) and as such is refusing to allow any links to This isn't going anywear, so I thought I'd ask you to take a look. Ungovernable ForceGot something to say? 04:21, 9 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Thanks for returning to the Healthcare article. Eventually some rational editing should surface - I really need to get other editors involved - and the article can be reduced back to the key concise points and properly presented without this bloated rubbish. I'd also be grateful if you could take a look at an article I've been writing practically alone : British African-Caribbean community and give me any thoughts or tips. The fact that I have had to write it almost alone for months says something about the demographics of wikipedia - such an important subject is almost ignored. I have a couple more paragraphs to write and I could really do with some pictures but it'd be good to get this to featured article status for many positive reasons. --Zleitzen 09:34, 9 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Heya, I decided to come back. :) I'll be just looking around, doing minor stuff, and try not to get dragged into pointless debates on stupid details. How've you been? Anything interesting happen on wikipedia these past few months? Just drop me a message if there's anything I should know, I'll probably get on IRC sometime too. BTW, if by the time you're reading this, my user page still hasn't been deleted, could you do it? Thanks :) -- infinity0 00:24, 10 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Terminal macedonology[edit]

Kindly check the talk there (Talk:Macedonia (terminology)#Dates) •NikoSilver 21:47, 10 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

CHRISTIANITY and Slavery[edit]

Thanks i think it needs to be developed, I am trying to add the race dynamics thing to the critic of Christianity thing because they have written so many pages, but forgotten to discuss race-domination in religion--Halaqah 14:27, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Hello Francis[edit]

Hello Francis,

I hope everything you're ok. I was checking your qualifications and what's interesting is that from software engineering you have jump to a different subject, linguistics, to do your master's. My question is—can you do such jump from a science or engineering barchelor to a humanities master's—I hope it's not too personal. take care. Ozgur Gerilla 01:06, 12 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello again,

Thank you very much for the information. I am interested in history, literature and language so it has to be one of those. I've did a little research and found MA in Turkish (combination of literature and language) in SOAS — spoke to the teacher and she said when you finish your barchelor come and see me. But I'm not sure if I would like to do Turkish for my master's. I got some time to decide the course but I'm sure I want to move from engineering/science to humanities. So how is your studies going? do you find linguistics interesting? Ozgur Gerilla 10:05, 12 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

That's very impressive of you—a PhD is quite difficult. I use MSN for instant messaging—just pass on your email or tell me to write mine. Ozgur Gerilla 23:44, 12 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Is says: "This user has not specified a valid e-mail address, or has chosen not to receive e-mail from other users." for you :) you must be offended :P Ozgur Gerilla 12:12, 13 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Need your view here[edit]

Occupation of Izmir. Users disputing the title, saying its not occupation, saying you cant occupy your 'own'. Saying cant prove Izmir was the Ottomans Empire etc etc. I've told them clear Francis, if they cant provide any sane reason, then i will remove the tag in two days. I'm not going to allow these articles to come to a standstill on the back of these ridicolous arguments. --A.Garnet 13:22, 13 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'd removed the PROD. All items in Category:In popular culture were created to move the crap away from main articles.

If deleted, the games and TV shows and Homer Simpson references will sneak into the article again and the cycle will repeat itself. Pavel Vozenilek 22:14, 14 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

This case is now closed and the results have been published at the link above.

Guy Montag is banned from articles which relate to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Guy Montag's Probation under the terms of Wikipedia:Requests_for_arbitration/Yuber#Guy Montag placed on probation is extended to include one year from the final date of this decision. KimvdLinde and other administrators are encouraged to effectively enforce Guy Montag's Probation in appropriate circumstances. Should Guy Montag violate any ban imposed by this decision he may be blocked for an appropriate period. All blocks are to be logged at Wikipedia:Requests for arbitration/Deir Yassin massacre#Log of blocks and bans.

For the Arbitration Committee. Arbitration Committee Clerk, FloNight 00:42, 15 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Request for comment and help[edit]

Francis, could you please comment on Talk:Armenia regarding the recent disruptions. I need a neutral opinion whether my characterization of User:Caligvla's edits as racist and disruptive is correct or not.--Eupator 18:04, 18 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Muchas gracias[edit]


Hey Francis, thanks a lot for supporting me in my recent RfA. It succeeded, and I am very grateful to all of you. If you ever need help with anything, please don't hesitate to ask. Also, feel free point out any mistakes I make! Thanks again, —Khoikhoi 04:15, 21 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

BTW, thanks for that great nom as well. ;-) —Khoikhoi 04:15, 21 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Antrarctic photos[edit]

Hi, Francis.

As you know the Soviet-PD tag is deleted on Commons and En-wiki and the images tagged by this license are about to be deleted very soon. I was trying to reupload a few of your Antarctic images on en-wiki using fairuse licenses but the image people are asking where the images came from and I do not know what to answer. Please check my talkpage fro the Orphanbot notices related to your images and give me a hand. Also you might want to transfer from Commons some other of your images. Alex Bakharev 07:28, 22 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks, for the reference!. Currently the image people have problems with Image:Stantsija_mirnyy.jpg and Image:Geophysics house at molodozhnoy.jpg that does not appear to be there Alex Bakharev 13:38, 22 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I understand your feelings ( and share them too). Alex Bakharev 13:52, 22 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


i inform you about nationalistic and flamer vandalism in Dinko Ranjina article [121].--PIO 14:19, 22 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Francis, the article has been tagged and nominated for deletion. I dont believe it meets the criteria for deletion, as an admin you probably know better. Could you please leave your view on Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Occupation of İzmir. Thanks, --A.Garnet 18:28, 23 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

again nationalism[edit]

I inform you about again nationalistic and flamer vandalism in Dinko Ranjina article [122] and message in my discussion [123]: will you block this vandal?--PIO 13:30, 25 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Moved to that other place

Deletion of Macedonism in wikiquote[edit]

Since you moved the quotes from the main article to Wikiquote, maybe you should get involved.   /FunkyFly.talk_  17:29, 28 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

BTW this was funny ;-) we also have that proverb in Greek: όταν λείπει η γάτα χορεύουν τα ποντίκια (['otan 'lipi i 'ɣata xo'revun ta po'ndica]).--Tekleni 19:22, 30 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Hope you're having a good time over in RoM? Fut.Perf. 21:08, 31 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Hope you check your e-mail while you're still there. •NikoSilver 22:53, 31 October 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Of course he will - how else will he receive the confirmation that Mr Crevenovski transfered his paycheck into his Swiss bank account?--Tekleni 00:21, 1 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

You agenda...[edit]

What are you going to FYROM for? To receive your paycheck, maybe? Hellenic Secret Services must be informed about your activity, Mr "Francis Tyers" (if that is indeed your real name). Who's financing you, what are your goals (I think both of those are pretty obvious)? :p --Tekleni 00:18, 1 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Could you please take a look at these pages and the corresponding talk pages? Jahangard 03:53, 4 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

A belated thank you[edit]

Hey, Francis, TS has a star now, and I wanted to thank you for all the help, and specifically for those nice, clean External links. Wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Tourette syndrome The other situation also seems to have subsided. I hope you're well, regards, Sandy (Talk) 16:37, 5 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Looks like we are comming close to a compromise. You can check in on the issue here.

thanks, --Caligvla 16:03, 6 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

The reason I conducted the strawpoll on my talk page was because, as User:Caligvla's official advocate, I am trying to negotiate a compromise on this controversial issue. However, if you wish, I am quite happy for you to copy the strawpoll to the Talk:Armenia page, so as to throw it open to those not directly involved in this dispute. Walton monarchist89 12:18, 7 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for moving the strawpoll. I have now announced the closing date and time. Walton monarchist89 14:31, 7 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank you for your support![edit]

23:42, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

If I'm a bit pale in the face now,
it's because of the amazing support
during my recent request for adminship
and because of all those new shiny buttons.

And if in the future
my use of them should not always be perfect
please don't hesitate to shout at me
any time, sunset, noon or sunrise.

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Yerzhan Ashykbayev[edit]

Hi, if you have the time I would like your input on whether to delete the article on Yerzhan Ashykbayev, the Foreign Ministry spokesman of the Government of Kazakhstan. Thanks, KazakhPol 18:35, 8 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks, KazakhPol 20:23, 8 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Anthropology project[edit]

I have communicated with The Ungovernable Force regarding the proposed anthropology project which you indicated an interest in, and have gotten the OK from him to move the project into wiki-space and make it active. He indicated that he is busy in school right now, but will be as active as he can be given that. The project page as it now exists is only a minimum page, and could use the input of interested parties such as yourself. Personally, I did noticably poorly in the one cultural anthropology class I took in college, so I'm bowing out of this one, but wish you and the other members of the project the best of luck with it. Thank you. Badbilltucker 21:45, 8 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

NK stub[edit]

Hi Francis. I nominated Template:Nagorno-Karabakh-stub for deletion, as we have such templates only for the internationally recognized states. Could you please have a look at the template's entry on the Templates for Deletion page. Thank you. Regards, Grandmaster 13:26, 9 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


hey Francis :) Sorry, I misunderstood the purpose of the flags, I thought that we were showing all of the country flags that existed after the war, and not just after 1992. My suggestion would be to add another column of flags, where the country flags that changed after 1995 and 2006, but were previously part of SFRY, should also be listed. What do you think? :) --GOD OF JUSTICE 23:35, 9 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thank you for the information, I have asked the people participating in the WikiProject for help. :) --GOD OF JUSTICE 23:59, 9 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Armenia strawpoll[edit]

NB This poll has now closed, it being Friday 10th November and about 10.30am where I live. The numbers are as follows:

As such, no mandate has appeared for making the requested changes to the article. As previously advertised, Caligvla and I are taking a break from this dispute for a week. After this, the case may be taken to the mediation cabal, although I hope to avoid this eventuality. Walton monarchist89 10:34, 10 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I was wondering if there are enough interested editors to start this project. Are you interested? Jahangard 19:35, 10 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Old Macedonian[edit]

Do not remove the term "Old Macedonian" from Old Church Slavonic. The term is used in the major English-language handbooks (Lunt, Schmalstieg, Nandris, IIRC Gardiner too), since Sts. Cyril and Methodius were from (Greek) Macedonia and OCS is based on the vernacular of Thessalonica. The term and the scholars who use it (in some cases preceding 1945) are unconnected to contemporary polemic about the Republic of Macedonia. CRCulver

Why should I add the term to the Macedonian terminology article? "Old Macedonian" when used by those scholars for OCS has nothing to do with the modern people identifying themselves as Macedonians, it's a term for a Slavic vernacular spoken to the south in the 9th century. I'll source it for the OCS article later on today, but I fear even sensible and sourced information will all too often get deleted by people thinking the term means something it doesn't. CRCulver 11:08, 14 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Hi Francis, can do with your help on the Ataturk page please. User wants to create a section insinuating Ataturk was responsible for genocide of Armenians and Pontians. Thanks, --A.Garnet 20:46, 16 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

World War II in Vojvodina[edit]

I am against merging of the two articles because they speak about two very different events. While goal of Axis occupation troops was simply to eliminate population of "wrong ethnic origin", the goal of partisans was to eliminate population of "wrong political affiliation". Although, one of the events was indeed consequence of another, it is best that both of them have their own separate articles. Also, the "Occupation of Vojvodina" article have see also section where is a link to "1944-1945 Killings in Bačka" article, so anybody could go there to read that article too. Problem is that killings in 1944-1945 are not the only consequence of the 1941-1944 occupation, thus any possible new section of the article speaking about consequences should mention all consequences, not only those killings in Bačka. PANONIAN (talk) 00:36, 17 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Closure of one of the district offices of Transnistrian Communist Party[edit]

Hi, Francis. I have a dispute with Mauco at Transnistria talk page and I know you are one of the persons Mauco asked you previously to mediate disputes on this subject. The subject of the dispute is that Transnistrian authorities closed the Rîbniţa office of Transnistrian Communist Party. I want to include this fact in the article, as I consider it a proof for the lack of democracy in Transnistria, and Mauco disagree. Please look at this and share your thoughts.--MariusM 10:35, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Actually, the bulk of the discussion is here: Talk:Politics of Transnistria. I have asked MariusM to prove relevance, which he hasn't done. He is trying to steer this particular edit into an overall discussion of democracy in Transnistria, and is avoiding my direct, specific questions. He is also calling me a vandal, accusing me of vandalism.[124] A third opinion might be helpful before we both get blocked for what could quickly turn into yet another 3RR event. - Mauco 13:11, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Could you...[edit]

Could you please close my Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ottoman Muslim casualties? I withdrew my nomination for deleting it. -- Clevelander 15:29, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks. -- Clevelander 15:37, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

State terrorism[edit]

Hi Francis, could you take a look at the shenanigans I have uncovered on List of acts labelled as state terrorism sorted by state - and elsewhere in the State terrorism area. Whilst removing a section of original research relating to Cuba some time ago, I noticed that 95% of the page carried original research. Having cut the material down to the sourced bone, still quite generously in my view, every time I turn my back, it creeps back. User:RaveenS has been very active on the subject of state terrorism throughout wikipedia, being involved in numerous templates, pages and categories - which have been rightly challenged by others who have also noticed this liberal use of WP:NOR and WP:V. Incidentally, RaveenS is supported by various anon accounts who share the same view and editing pattern. --Zleitzen 16:57, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]


Francis, given your language experience, I was hoping you would know - or would know someone who knows - about the changes just made to Coprolalia (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views). I need for someone to check on the Greek translations that were just inserted there: I have no idea if the info is anon IP vandalism or correct. Do you know of someone who can check? Thanks, Sandy (Talk) 19:29, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Done [125]. Fut.Perf. 19:35, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks !! Sandy (Talk) 19:39, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Reply[reply]
  1. ^ Greek Macedonia "not a problem", The Times (London), August 5 1957
  2. ^ Patrides, Greek Magazine of Toronto, September - October, 1988, p. 3.
  3. ^ Simons, Marlise (February 3, 1992). "As Republic Flexes, Greeks Tense Up". New York Times.
  4. ^ Lenkova, M. (1999). "Greek Helsinki Monitor: Macedonians of Bulgaria" (pdf). Minorities in Southeast Europe. Greek Helsinki Monitor, Center for Documentation and Information on Minorities in Europe - Southeast Europe. {{cite web}}: Unknown parameter |accessmonthday= ignored (help); Unknown parameter |accessyear= ignored (|access-date= suggested) (help); Unknown parameter |coauthors= ignored (|author= suggested) (help)
  5. ^ "Rainbow - Vinozhito political party". The Macedonian minority in Albania. {{cite web}}: Unknown parameter |accessmonthday= ignored (help); Unknown parameter |accessyear= ignored (|access-date= suggested) (help)
  6. ^ "Makedonija - General Information". {{cite web}}: Unknown parameter |accessmonthday= ignored (help); Unknown parameter |accessyear= ignored (|access-date= suggested) (help)