User talk:Extraordinary Writ

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By far the funniest and most clever Wikipedia page I randomly stumbled on. Kudos. The fish genuinely made me laugh out loud — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sumtimz I B Learnin (talkcontribs) 07:04, 27 December 2020 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Question from Gjfyfyf (15:46, 18 October 2023)[edit]

how to get backlink --Gjfyfyf (talk) 15:46, 18 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello Gjfyfyf. On Wikipedia, our goal is to create an encyclopedia—not to help people profit financially. Readers are looking for useful and unbiased information, so adding links to promote your website is not allowed, and those who do it repeatedly may be blocked from editing. Please consider using social media, paid advertising, or some other means if you want to draw attention to your website. Thanks for your understanding. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 00:00, 19 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

thanks for editing the controversies about MK![edit]

have this bloody award Babysharkboss2 was here!! 18:33, 20 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Um, thanks...I think. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 19:04, 20 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Editing Andrew Jackson[edit]

Thank you so much for taking on the editing of Andrew Jackson! I jumped in to help out quite a while back, reducing the length by 4.4K words, broadening the references, and addressing the issues of balance that were raised so that they are currently not a topic of discussion. But that was all I could contribute. As you see, it needed more support.

The work you have done to date is already a great improvement. If you need any minor support, let me know, but it seems you have everything under control. It'd be nice to see this article as a "save" in FAR. If it is, it'll be because of you. Appreciatively. Wtfiv (talk) 16:33, 22 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks, Wtfiv! Obviously you've done the lion's share of what needed to be done here: I'm just putting another coat of paint on the house you've already built, so to speak. Feel free to let me know (or just revert) if you think any of my changes are moving things in the wrong direction. Looking forward to seeing it kept at FAR! Extraordinary Writ (talk) 19:23, 22 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello Extraordinary Writ,

You recently offered a statement in a request for arbitration. The Arbitration Committee has accepted that request for arbitration and an arbitration case has been opened at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Industrial agriculture. Evidence that you wish the arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence subpage, at Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Industrial agriculture/Evidence. Please add your evidence by November 8, 2023, which is when the evidence phase closes. For a guide to the arbitration process, see Wikipedia:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration.

For the Arbitration Committee,
~ ToBeFree (talk) 01:09, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]


I rewrote the sentence about the 1960 Hawaii electors and removed the reference to what Nixon said about it. I don't know that there was anything wrong with it before, but it wasn't maybe the best way to reference how Chesebro used that precedent in his memo.

Chesebro used that precedent as a key part of his argument that Jan. 6 is the only deadline that matters for counting electoral votes.

I don't understand why you flagged the photo for deletion. Utahredrock (talk) 02:34, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks, the Hawaii section looks better. As for the mugshot, it ran afoul of our fairly strict rules on using copyrighted images: with a few exceptions that don't apply here, non-free images can't be used to depict a living person since it's possible to get a freely licensed image instead (even if that image doesn't currently exist). Extraordinary Writ (talk) 02:55, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Is a mugshot from Georgia copyrighted? I honestly don't know, but it doesn't seem like it would be. Utahredrock (talk) 03:08, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Works of the U.S. federal government aren't copyrighted, but "the works of most state and local governments are subject to copyright", including in Georgia. (See here for similar thoughts.) Extraordinary Writ (talk) 03:30, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for that link. The main point is that people can't use a photo like that for profit. Betsy Rosenblatt, a professor at Case Western Reserve University’s School of Law, said the "First Amendment makes a lot of allowances for things like parody, newsworthiness, commentary and criticism."
OK, I get if there's any question, which seems to be the case here, then Wikimedia wouldn't want it. Those articles (it linked to a second article) don't come out and say what Georgia or Fulton County's policy actually is. They mostly speculate that people probably can't use such images for profit.
Any thoughts on where I can get a usable photo of Chesebro? Utahredrock (talk) 03:45, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes, legally speaking it'd probably be fair use, but Wikipedia chooses to take a much harder line on fair use than the law requires (which goes back to the Wikipedia:Non-free content page I linked earlier). I haven't been able to find any freely licensed pictures of Chesebro, unfortunately. It's possible one will show up as the case progresses, but otherwise the only way would be for someone to take a picture of him and upload it here. (I realize in practice this means the article will likely go without an image, but for better or worse, that's what the community has decided it wants in this situation.) Extraordinary Writ (talk) 04:17, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Got it. Thx. Utahredrock (talk) 17:51, 5 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

While I appreciate the terseness constraints on edit summaries, I didn't add anything boldly. I corrected an addition to make it more closely match what I believe existing policy to be. Had there not been a bold edit, a response would have been unnecessary. In this case, I believed a modification more useful to a subsequent discussion than a simple revert en bloc, such edits are encouraged by WP:BRDR, and you'll note my comment on the talk page recognized the strong possibility (inevitability?) that someone would do that later. Jclemens (talk) 04:55, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

I'm not sure that's really a meaningful distinction, but either way, no worries. Personally I'd support something broadly similar to your wording, but given how contentious this is whenever it comes up, it really needs to be resolved at the global-consensus level (as I've said before). Extraordinary Writ (talk) 05:12, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

How to revert changes properly?[edit]

Hi, It seems someone manipulates with population of China (increase by 1 billion), please checkout: Kbelyavs88 (talk) 06:39, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Done! Thanks for letting me know, Kbelyavs88. In this case the method described here worked, but other times the unhelpful edits have to be fixed manually. If you run into a similar problem in the future, feel free to just let me or another experienced editor know. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 06:47, 25 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]



You've been whacked with a wet trout.

Don't take this too seriously. Someone just wants to let you know that you did something silly.

You have been trouted for: Requesting to get back the page that I contributed for an NGO and not-for-profit organization: <<shantmanas>> which got deleted Lakshmi VB Narsimhan 11:22, 25 October 2023 (UTC)

Lakshmin, I can restore this page if you want me to, but it clearly does not meet our minimum requirements for articles about organizations, so if I restore it I will also start a deletion discussion, which will probably lead to its being deleted again. Let me know what you'd like me to do. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 02:27, 26 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sir, if no obligation, only then I would request you to restore and I will satisfy min requirements as soon as possible and also add-in more relevant content and references to this article to keep improving it. Thanks a lot for your response. Lakshmi VB Narsimhan 09:09, 26 October 2023 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lakshmin (talkcontribs)
Lakshmin, I've restored it for you as a draft at Draft:Shantmanas, where it won't be at risk of deletion for a while. When you're ready, you can submit it for review by clicking the blue "submit your draft for review" button, although it will still need in-depth coverage from reliable sources to be accepted. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 03:39, 27 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks a lot Sir. I made few edits including few reliable sources. Infact, there are a lot, let me know if you want me to add more before its accepted. Lakshmi VB Narsimhan 16:26, 27 October 2023 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lakshmin (talkcontribs)

Anyone who can help me in making it an article for Wikipedia with a neutral point of view? Lakshmi VB Narsimhan 13:06, 6 November 2023 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lakshmin (talkcontribs)

Question from OldhouseguyLLC (21:15, 26 October 2023)[edit]

Hi - this is the first time I am doing this and am quite overwhelmed. I created a draft and hit the publish button since there was not a button save as draft. The article is "Charles Lewis Lane". Most of the information came from his obituary. Can I footnote all the obit info or do I need to totally re-write it? --OldhouseguyLLC (talk) 21:15, 26 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi OldhouseguyLLC. Don't worry, you're doing fine. Despite the name, the publish button actually does just save it as a draft. You can still access it here at this link, and there should be an "edit" button toward the top for you to make any more changes. Footnotes are just fine too. I've edited the draft for you to adjust the formatting; if you want to add any more footnotes, there should be a "cite" button at the top when you're editing that'll walk you through the process. (If you get stuck, just let me know.) One other thing: to show that Lane is significant enough to deserve an article, it'd be helpful if you could find one or two more sources that discuss him in detail (newspaper clippings, books, trustworthy websites, etc.) and cite them in the draft too. Let me know if you run into any other issues or have any more questions. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 04:12, 27 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Hello - I think I have most of the info entered. I would like to change the title to "Lewis Lane" since this is the name he went by during his career. I have a lot of information on him including a photo of his composition "Fragments" that I took at a local museum. Some of the information is in announcement cards. OldhouseguyLLC (talk) 20:52, 16 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Nice work, OldhouseguyLLC! I moved the page to use the shorter name, added the image you uploaded, and made a handful of other minor changes. If there's anything else you have questions about, feel free to ask. Otherwise, if you're ready for the draft to become a regular article, let me know and I can take care of that for you: it definitely meets the requirements. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 08:08, 17 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That sounds great. Yes please submit it for me. Thanks! OldhouseguyLLC (talk) 18:59, 17 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Done, OldhouseguyLLC—see Lewis Lane. If you found this interesting/enjoyable, I hope you'll consider sticking around: almost any article can be improved with some digging on, so people who know how to use it effectively are really valuable! Extraordinary Writ (talk) 08:45, 18 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thank you for all your help! This all began when writing the history of my house where he lived in his early years. OldhouseguyLLC (talk) 15:35, 18 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]


How I can insert my images to my page ? --Dharmendra Kumar (DK-JALALABAD) (talk) 07:45, 27 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello Dharmendra Kumar. When you're editing the page, there should be a button toward the top that says "insert". It opens a menu that includes "images and media". If you click that button and choose "upload", it'll walk you through the process of adding an image. For copyright reasons, you should generally only upload pictures that you took yourself (with some exceptions). If you have any other questions, feel free to ask. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 07:22, 28 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

November Articles for creation backlog drive[edit]

Hello Extraordinary Writ:

WikiProject Articles for creation is holding a month long Backlog Drive!
The goal of this drive is to reduce the backlog of unreviewed drafts to less than 2 months outstanding reviews from the current 4+ months. Bonus points will be given for reviewing drafts that have been waiting more than 30 days. The drive is running from 1 November 2023 through 30 November 2023.

You may find Category:AfC pending submissions by age or other categories and sorting helpful.

Barnstars will be given out as awards at the end of the drive.

There is a backlog of over 100 pages, so start reviewing drafts. We're looking forward to your help! MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 13:24, 31 October 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

You've got mail[edit]

Hello, Extraordinary Writ. Please check your email; you've got mail!
It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template.Maliner (talk) 08:22, 1 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Looks like this has been taken care of. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 22:16, 2 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Administrators' newsletter – November 2023[edit]

News and updates for administrators from the past month (October 2023).

Administrator changes

added 0xDeadbeef
readded Tamzin
removed Dennis Brown

Interface administrator changes

added Pppery

Guideline and policy news

Technical news


  • Eligible editors are invited to self-nominate themselves from 12 November 2023 until 21 November 2023 to stand in the 2023 Arbitration Committee elections.
  • Xaosflux, RoySmith and Cyberpower678 have been appointed to the Electoral Commission for the 2023 Arbitration Committee Elections. BusterD is the reserve commissioner.
  • Following a motion, the contentious topic designation of Prem Rawat has been struck. Actions previously taken using this contentious topic designation are still in force.
  • Following several motions, multiple topic areas are no longer designated as a contentious topic. These contentious topic designations were from the Editor conduct in e-cigs articles, Liancourt Rocks, Longevity, Medicine, September 11 conspiracy theories, and Shakespeare authorship question cases.
  • Following a motion, remedies 3.1 (All related articles under 1RR whenever the dispute over naming is concerned), 6 (Stalemate resolution) and 30 (Administrative supervision) of the Macedonia 2 case have been rescinded.
  • Following a motion, remedy 6 (One-revert rule) of the The Troubles case has been amended.
  • An arbitration case named Industrial agriculture has been opened. Evidence submissions in this case close 8 November.


Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:22, 7 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Adrija Roy[edit]

Thanks a lot Sir/Ma'am for closing the DRV of Adrija Roy. Sir/Ma'am we have recreated the article and need a favour from you. Sir/Ma'am we are not any paid editors. We are just a group of editor friends who create new articles of Hindi television actors. So can you please check the article we created on Adrija Roy and tell us if there are any more changes to be made in it? (talk) 10:52, 8 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

It looks like the article has been nominated for deletion again, so I'd just suggest focusing on the feedback of editors in the discussion. If you can find any other high-quality sources (preferably from somewhere other than the Times of India) that discuss Roy in detail, adding them might be helpful, although you should only add the best ones rather than just including every article you can find. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 17:20, 8 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Question from Dilshadzahan9988 on Mirabad-e Ansari (15:08, 8 November 2023)[edit]

रसूलुल्लाह ﷺ ने फरमाया बशक अल्लाह ताला के निनानवे नाम हैं। जो अल्लाह ताला के नामो को याद करेगा, जन्नत में दाख़िल होगा। (मुस्लिम: 6809 --Dilshadzahan9988 (talk) 15:08, 8 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

रसूलुल्लाह ﷺ ने फरमाया बशक अल्लाह ताला के निनानवे नाम हैं। जो अल्लाह ताला के नामो को याद करेगा, जन्नत में दाख़िल होगा। (मुस्लिम: 6809 Dilshadzahan9988 (talk) 15:09, 8 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello Dilshadzahan9988. This page is for asking questions about editing the English-language version of Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. If you have any such questions, feel free to ask. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 17:25, 8 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Question from Sandroacca on Electronic license plate (21:40, 12 November 2023)[edit]

The patent link on this page does not work (reference 2)

link should be - --Sandroacca (talk) 21:40, 12 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Yep, thanks for noticing that, Sandroacca! I've updated the link to use the correct number from the patent website—looks like it's working now. Let me know if you have any other questions, either about this or anything else. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 08:52, 13 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Message from Manishsen1[edit]

Why this page is rejected? Manishsen1 (talk) 17:08, 14 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Manishsen1, it looks like your draft has been declined because there aren't any trustworthy sources that talk about the newspaper in detail, which is a minimum requirement for Wikipedia articles. If you can find any high-quality sources about the newspaper, feel free to add them; otherwise, it probably isn't eligible for an article at this time. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 07:18, 15 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Question from Mr Fixer False! (03:22, 17 November 2023)[edit]

Hi! I'm a novice editor, and likely won't edit much however I do genuinely want to help if I have the free time. So, I have one fairly simple question to ask. How do you identify when a article needs a change and/or is incomplete? --Mr Fixer False! (talk) 03:22, 17 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hello, Mr Fixer False!, and welcome to Wikipedia! Pretty much any article can be improved in some way or another, and one of the best ways to help is just to make minor improvements to pages you're already reading, even if it's as simple as fixing a typo or rewording a sentence. That said, if you want to find articles that are in particular need of help, this page has some nice lists that are updated pretty frequently. You can also try the Task Center, which has several activities that are suitable for new editors. Let me know if you have any other questions! Extraordinary Writ (talk) 08:22, 17 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Bayshore Global Management[edit]

Hi. I noticed Bayshore Global Management has been deleted because it was created by a banned user. I am thinking of creating the page again as its a big family office. However I want to see the contents of the deleted page first before I consider doing so. I don't want to waste time researching this firm only to find out its inherently non-notable. Can this be done? - Imcdc Contact 13:02, 18 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Imcdc. The Internet Archive saved the old version here—does that do the trick for you? If you need it userfied, I'm happy to do that too. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 18:43, 18 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
@Extraordinary Writ Thanks. This will do. I'll see if its worth redoing. Imcdc Contact 01:46, 19 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Question from Suwon15 on Love All Play (TV series) (10:19, 25 November 2023)[edit]

hello, I wanted to add the details for part 12 of the Ost but it appears the page is in coding I'm not familiar with. Is there a way I can just enter the info as text? thanks! --Suwon15 (talk) 10:19, 25 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Hi Suwon15. If you want, you can just tell me on this page what exactly you want added—I'd be happy to take care of it for you. The coding actually isn't as complicated as it looks, so you might want to try copying the previous entry and making the relevant changes, but I definitely understand if you'd rather not. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 07:37, 26 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Books & Bytes – Issue 59[edit]

The Wikipedia Library: Books & Bytes
Issue 59, September – October 2023

  • Spotlight: Introducing a repository of anti-disinformation projects
  • Tech tip: Library access methods

Read the full newsletter

Sent by MediaWiki message delivery on behalf of The Wikipedia Library team --16:15, 27 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

ArbCom 2023 Elections voter message[edit]

Hello! Voting in the 2023 Arbitration Committee elections is now open until 23:59 (UTC) on Monday, 11 December 2023. All eligible users are allowed to vote. Users with alternate accounts may only vote once.

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Greetings Extraordinary Writ. I was looking for an active administrator and I saw that you recently edited WP:ANI. Regarding this situation, see User talk:TheMovieGuy#Plagiarism and copyright issue with plot summary. This editor has not responded to my message regarding a copyvio but has continued editing over days. Could you advise me how to proceed in this situation? Thank you. starship.paint (RUN) 08:33, 28 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Thanks Starship.paint. I've left another message in the hope of getting a response at some point. The main question is whether it's just a one-off incident or a long-term pattern. If there's nothing beyond occasional mistakes, we can just treat this as a warning and move on; if it's a long-term pattern, a WP:CCI may be necessary and, if there's no engagement, possibly a block. I don't have time to dig through their contributions right now (it's getting late here), but if you notice any other copyvios, feel free to let me know. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 09:10, 28 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks very much Extraordinary Writ. It doesn't seem to be a long-term pattern, the editor's main interests are movies (that they have presumably watched) and adding information about movies seems not to be copied. I'm guessing this is a book not read, but the editor doesn't seem to have edited too many articles on books. starship.paint (RUN) 10:52, 28 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
We now have what seems to be a satisfactory response, Starship.paint, and I've revdelled the problematic material, so I don't think there's anything more to be done here. Thanks again for the message. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 08:26, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Indeed. Thank you again Extraordinary Writ. starship.paint (RUN) 09:15, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Why was this fancruft nonsense undeleted?[edit]

Wikipedia:Deletion_review/Log/2023_October_27#SSSniperWolf And how in the world, if the intention was to allow in back into draftspace, did it get out in mainspace? I see no explanation for either action, and no rational argument offered by the requester and their supporters. I only realized that this was undeleted when another incessant question at RSN. The undelete should be undone if possible...and frankly, the article salted if I had my druthers. Banks Irk (talk) 00:24, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Also, I see that the "undeleted" article talkpage has no link to the five deletion discussions, and all history is gone on both the article and talkpage. Banks Irk (talk) 00:31, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Banks Irk, the history here is extremely convoluted, but I think this is the gist of it: one admin signed off on undeleting the old draftspace version, it was rewritten, and Alexis Jazz moved it to mainspace after another admin took it off the title blacklist. I didn't actually undelete/unprotect anything: by the time I closed the DRV, all of that had already happened. My best suggestion at this point would just be to send it back to AfD (for the sixth time...I know, I know) if you don't think the new sources are adequate. The old AfDs do seem to be linked at the top of Talk:SSSniperWolf—is there somewhere else they need to be? As for the history, there wasn't much interest at the DRV in undeleting hundreds of revisions, heavily edited (and some oversighted) such that it's not at all clear which are the most complete, but if there's anything in particular you'd like restored, let me know. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 00:50, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Thanks for the explanation. I understand. I now realize that the AFD template only shows up on desktop view, not mobile, so my mistake there. I'm not invested enough in this to actually start a sixth AFD...I guess I am just exasperated and exhausted by the incessant RSN questions about ridiculous proposed sources desperately seeking a basis for notability of one YouTuber's feud with another YouTuber. Banks Irk (talk) 01:07, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Extraordinary Writ, I can confirm that's pretty much the gist of it. (except for what Cryptic already pointed out below about the blacklist entry)
While helping with WP:SSSniperWolf sources overview, Davest3r08 posted many questions on WP:RS/N. As I'm generally not actively watching RS/N nor WP:HOUNDING Dave, I was unaware this was happening at all.
When I asked "another incessant question" on RS/N yesterday it wasn't to establish notability for SSSniperWolf. The source in question provided a new factlet, and it's a partner of GameStar, the "best-selling German-language magazine focused on PC gaming" according to that article. Either way, after their comment I feel sufficiently discouraged from ever asking about the reliability of a source for the SSSniperWolf article ever again. I'll just use my own best judgment from now on.
And I don't even like SSSniperWolf..Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 09:49, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Alexis Jazz had already moved it to that title when I unblacklisted it. The blacklist doesn't affect pagemovers anyway. —Cryptic 04:33, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Yes, you're right—apologies. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 05:12, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
So, you're telling me that because AJ has pagemover rights, they were able to recreate a deleted and salted article simply by recreating it under a new name, and then moving it back to the salted title? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills! Does no one else think this is insane?Banks Irk (talk) 22:53, 29 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Well, the other factor is that the title wasn't fully salted: it was only extended-confirmed protected, apparently to allow the possibility of recreation through WP:AFC. Had it been set to admin-only, Alexis Jazz wouldn't have been able to move it there directly, although there are still ways of doing it indirectly. Our policies on recreation (like WP:G4) are actually much more lax than many people realize, which reduces the amount of hassle in some cases but increases it tremendously in others (like this one). Personally I'd support tightening G4 at least somewhat, but those proposals have been shot down repeatedly over the years, alas. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 00:37, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I'm seriously thinking about taking this to ANI rather than another AFD. It's absurd that an editor who loses a AFD battle (for the 5th time) so badly that an article is not merely deleted but salted can so easily bypass and game the process like this. My dismay is tempered only by my admiration for such a clever exploitation of rights that I believe no one imagined could be utilized so cleverly and nefariously. Banks Irk (talk) 01:03, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
To be fair, there are quite a few sources that postdate the AfD and are at least arguably reliable/sigcov, so it's not entirely unreasonable to think notability had changed, and Alexis Jazz did go to DRV first and get at least tepid support for recreation. ANI isn't likely to want to get involved here—it'll just lead to more unproductive back-and-forths. Up to you, though. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 01:20, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
You're likely correct that a trip to the dramaboards is unlikely to be productive. Since I doubt that starting a 6th AFD would be worth the effort, why would I be deluded into wading into the ANI briarpatch? Banks Irk (talk) 03:50, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Banks Irk, It's absurd that an editor who loses a AFD battle (for the 5th time) so badly that an article is not merely deleted but salted can so easily bypass and game the process like this.
Just noting that I hadn't actually participated in any of those 5 AfDs.Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 09:09, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
The blacklisting would have taken precedence over the salting; it restricted creation to admins, pagemovers, and template editors, while the edit-confirmed salting allowed just about any remotely established editor. (And the blacklisting applied to every namespace, and of course covered all the various miscapitalizations.) There wasn't even any need to recreate at a different title and then move; Alexis Jazz could have just created the page directly. There is a big warning message, though, and any pagemover/template-editor who deliberately recreated a blacklisted title with content as problematic as the reason it was blacklisted would very quickly have the permission revoked.
So far as I can find, the only related pages that were salted to administrator-only - which was not redundant to the blacklisting - were Draft:Sssniperwolf (logs) and Draft:SSSniperWolf (logs); the missing puzzle-pieces in the latter, which skips directly from Deb's admin-only salting to Alexis Jazz's move to mainspace, are at yet a third capitalization, Draft:SSSniperwolf (logs). —Cryptic 02:48, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Sorry for any contribution I may have made to this mess. Deb (talk) 12:20, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Re G4 laxness specifically, I am still embittered, eighteen and a half years later, about how the current "substantially identical" wording came about. G4 used to just read "Reposted content that was deleted according to Wikipedia deletion policy. ¶ •This does not apply to content that was undeleted according to undeletion policy." In a very, very broad sitewide RFC that was almost entirely proposals for new criteria, the rewording to what's essentially the current version was stuck unobtrusively in the middle (example pre-closure version), by which time very many voters were suffering from fatigue and banner blindness, and variously didn't see that this was a change to a current criterion rather than an entirely new one, or were mostly concentrating on the cosmetic parts of the change (like not applying to previous speedies, which of course could still be speedied for the same reason again instead of G4). There were plenty of support comments like "To [sic] many VfDd articles are recreated, then endlessly re-debated" and "In practice the only difference between the current and proposed wording is that the proposed system would allow a slightly different repost to be deleted, but that does tend to happen already. Seems like a trivial change to me." that make it clear that people thought they were broadening G4's applicability rather than narrowing it. —Cryptic 03:28, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
That is illuminating, and utterly maddening. Thanks for the background. The idea that a deleted and salted article can be resurrected completely out of normal expected process is insane. Banks Irk (talk) 03:42, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Fascinating...I hadn't seen that RfC before, so thanks for sharing. I always find it enlightening to hear the real backstories of policies that are now treated as if they came down on stone tablets from Mount Sinai. It's interesting that while even pretending to follow policy as written occurred to you in 2005, because that gap between policy and practice is of course exactly what's happened with G4, and in a way it's served as a sort of immune response against the unrealistic "substantially identical" standard. Perhaps someday we'll bring policy and practice back into line, although I'm not holding my breath. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 09:26, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Deletion of Tavi Castro[edit]

Hi there, I'm writing on behalf of management for Tavi Castro. To our surprise his wikipedia article was deleted. Can we please work towards reinstating his page and updating it. He is involved in Warner brothers new movie Aquaman 2 and the lost chambers and we would like the page to be updated and live as soon as possible for major updates.

Notability is not a problem here, a simple google search or his 16 million followers on social media should more than suffice , thank you very much . Bodyengineerswiki (talk) 19:50, 30 November 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Bodyengineerswiki, I've restored Tavi Castro as a contested proposed deletion. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 02:54, 1 December 2023 (UTC)Reply[reply]