Talk:Dissolution of Czechoslovakia

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Communist Beginnings[edit]

It needs to be clarified that by 1946 the Communist Party, the Socialist Party, and the Social Democratic Party won majority representation in Parliament, or the National Assembly. Only in 1948 did Stalinization occur. It is wrong to say Czechoslovakia emerged communist because of the USSR. I cite:

  • Schwartz, Morton, "Czechoslovakia's New Political Model: A Design for Renewal," The Journal of Politics 1968
  • Fowkes, Ben The Rise and Fall of Communism in Eastern Europe, St. Martins Press, 1993
  • Scholpfin, George, Politics in Eastern Europe: 1945-1992, Blackwell 1993
  • Kolakowski, Leszek, Main Currents of Marxism: Its Origin, Growth, and Dissolution Vol. III, Clarendon Press, 1978

I may be compelled to change the wording so as to dispel the myth that the USSR alone installed communism in Eastern Europe. Billyvamp4 (talk) 14:58, 17 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

History of the separation[edit]

"By the 1990s, in economic terms, the Czech Republic's GDP per capita was some 20% higher than Slovakia's, but its long-run GDP growth was lower. Money transfers from the Czech budget to Slovakia, which had been the rule in the past, were stopped in January 1991." Please were is the reference to these estimations? I would rather say: it was reported by Mass-media that GDP in Czech part is higher and there is massive money transfers to Slovakia. Finnaly it is not only true but was also a important reason for split (together with medialisation of underpresentation of Slovaks by Slovak massmedia). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 147.175.80.47 (talk) 10:57, 9 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Slovak language coverages from Slovakia[edit]

a) Sentence The Czech TV news, however, recently started to reintroduce Slovak language coverages from Slovakia. looks too optimistic. Slovak news (~10 minutes) are aired early in the morning and in main news, events from Slovakia are sometimes commented in Slovak. The use of Slovak on Czech TV has dropped considerably.

I meant that for one year or so, there has been a report on Slovakia in Slovak in the main news almost everyday, which previously was not the case (and if so it was in Czech). For me, this is quite striking. (I did not mean the main Czech news on Slovak TV in the night or the Slovak news on Czech TV at 6 a.m., of course... :) )

I do not watch TV much but hearing Slovak is very rare there. News from Slovakia is usually told by Czech reporter sent there (quite understandable - its near, yet one gets allowances, no danger, easy work). Maybe this sentence should be removed from article.
The point is it is not a Czech reporter anymore (I know that this was the case before). Just pick out several days (outside the holidays), watch the main news (in 19:15 or so) and you will see what I mean ... But I'm not insisiting on the one sentence ...Juro 21:37, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)
Just about the current state: The three main Czech TV stations have in Slovakia Slovak speaking reporters. Interviews with locals are not being dubbed, but sometimes subtitled (especially when the speaking person uses a dialect). Slovaks also appear in TV talk (and other kinds of ) shows and speak just their language (with exception those living in Czechia who can Czech). Bob 08:52, 25 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

15:14, 29 November 2010 (UTC)15:14, 29 November 2010 (UTC)15:14, 29 November 2010 (UTC)125.25.141.4 (talk) 15:14, 29 November 2010 (UTC)!!!!![reply]

Slovaks studying at universities in Czech Rep.[edit]

b) Slovaks studying at universities in Czech Rep. - wasn't there dip in their numbers? I remember in the beginning it was negotiated just some 70 students could study in other country for free. People who study unis in CR in Czech language have now the same conditions (= no fees, access to free accomodation) no matter where they are from but this was established years after dissolution.

I left that out because I am not sure (it's always better to say nothing than to lie...). The number was definitely much higher in reality. There were some problems in one year, but then they somehow solved it...But if you have better information, you can re-insert that part, of course.

I have only anectodal information. Better leave as it is.

Sametovy rozvod[edit]

c) Is the term Sametovy rozvod actually used in Slovakia? (It is not in CR)

I know that and definitely not. (And in Slovak, it would have to be Nežný rozvod, because the revolution is called Nežná revolúcia). The term is an English invention, because - I assume - from the international point of view the most striking thing about the divorce was the fact that it was non-violent (given the then developments in Yugoslavia etc.).Juro 22:52, 20 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I'll update article accordingly. Pavel Vozenilek 18:06, 21 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Gypsies with criminal records[edit]

The Czech Republic law allowed to grant citizenship automatically only to those without felony record and this excluded a very large percentage of Gypsies.

"A very large percentage" can mean just about anything. This needs to be qualified better in order to avoid being weaselly and discriminatory towards the Gypsies. Who, BTW, prefer to be called Roma, too. --Joy [shallot] 14:18, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)

AFAIK Czech statistics in criminality do not quantify race or nationality, since '90 (leading often to wild speculations). People oposing such citizenship law argued that the number (both absolute and relative) of affected Gypsies is so high that it makes the law targeted specifically on them (this was quite likely intention of proponents of the law). Please feel free to reword the sentence. The name Roma got used in CR only later and in media/official texts. Pavel Vozenilek 18:47, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Dubcek and his influence[edit]

"The untimely death of Alexander Dubček was widely seen as depriving the "Czechoslovakists" of the one figure with sufficent public standing to have successfully resisted the break up of the federation."

Roma section: "existing state" is what?[edit]

"The issue dragged on for years and in the end the existing state was codified."

Perhaps being dumb here, but which "existing state"? That the Roma are stateless? That the Roma are citizens of Slovakia? Of the Czech Republic? Shenme 05:06, 25 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Split of Czechoslovakia[edit]

The title of this article (Velvet Divorce) is naive and definitely wrong. It had nothing to do with so called velvet revolution.

The page should be renamed. I suggest neutral Split of Czechoslovakia, see also Czech Republic (info-box).

-- Cepek 08:10, 10 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Cepek on this one, just because the term is used in journalism doesn't mean it should be used in an ecyclopedia. Also, the term was only used in the US and UK and to a much lesser degree in Australia, virtually nowhere else. However I suggest renaming the article to "Dissolution of Czechoslovakia", not split. +Hexagon1 (t) 03:02, 12 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
If no-one objects in the next few days, I'm moving it. If someone does, we'll hold a WP:Requested Moves vote. +Hexagon1 (t) 15:06, 19 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I had to look up dissolution in my dictionary but/and I agree. My Czech dictionary in the last (5-th) meaning of dissolution reads nevázanost, zhýralost, zhýralý život, prostopášnictví and I can only agree, dissolution of Czechoslovakia was zhýralá prostopášnost. Sorry for mixing Czech and English ... actually, because someone changed dissolution to split in Czech Republic infobox, I came to a false opinion, that split is a better term in this context, so I suggested it here. Cepek 16:48, 19 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
I think you may be misunderstanding the term, dissolution is just a general term refering to "rozpuštění, rozklad, rozložení". Zhýralost is a very very strange translation, I can't imagine ever hearing dissolution used in such a context - ever. That's seriously just plain weird... +Hexagon1 (t) 11:40, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I was just joking a bit with zhýralost and nevázanost (this translation is really very strange). Cepek 19:01, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]
OK, moved with no objections. +Hexagon1 (t) |*̥̲̅ ̲̅†̲̅| |>̲̅-̲̅| 11:57, 29 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Velvet Divorce in English-speaking media[edit]

"It is sometimes referred to as the Velvet Divorce in American and British media."

I have seen "divorce de velours" in French language media from Quebec and France. It is possible that other languages have adopted the expression. This phrase gives the impression that this is specifically an English language occurence, which it does not appear to be. --Liberlogos 23:15, 23 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Divorce de velours seems to have been used in French, but the equivalent not so much in Spanish. Where I saw it in Spanish in a recent Google search, the term was virtually limited to the Spanish Wikipedia, obviously a translation from this one. Sincerely, GeorgeLouis (talk) 13:53, 1 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Maps of the new states?[edit]

Do we have a map on Wikipedia showing both new countries well, or can somebody make one? Would help illustrate this article quite fittingly.MadMaxDog 09:07, 25 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

How about now? +Hexagon1 (t) 14:20, 7 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Public Opinion[edit]

How was the public opinion about the seperation. My relatives live in Prague and my mum said many were against it --88.153.177.193 (talk) 06:11, 3 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

That's true in any political situation. However, a majority of the people seem to have wanted the split into seperate nation-states. Time will tell how wise it was. If the populace one day decides a re-unification is beneficial, I'm sure it will be done in a friendly atmosphere. 98.67.15.192 (talk) 17:51, 16 January 2011 (UTC) HammerFilmFan[reply]

Dual citizenship of Slovaks and Czechs following dissolution[edit]

Currently the article states unequivocally that dual citizenship was not allowed and was only possible "years later". However, my understanding of the Citizen Act (Slovakia) is that following the dissolution citizens had a period of one year to apply for the dual citizenship but that very few people opted to do so. Perhaps someone with more knowledge on the matter can enlighten us or update the entry to include this information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 134.36.15.252 (talk) 13:00, 12 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Wrong linking of English and German articles[edit]

The linking of the English and the German articles is wrong. While the English article is about the dissolution of Czechoslovakia in 1993, the German article is about the German occupation of Czechia in 1939. Could someone please correct this? Unfortunately, I don't know how to do it.--Mottenkiste (talk) 20:47, 18 February 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Respekt[edit]

Four times, the article quotes an otherwise unsourced and article-less Respekt, which is of course the Czech journal but who's to know that? Also, shouldn't the statements thus confirmed give a source, like the article in Respekt that is (probably) quoted there? ahoi --WernR (talk) 12:32, 19 November 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Implausible claim[edit]

"According to the Prague Post (September 8, 2014: Is the Czech Republic richer than Slovakia?), "Slovak GDP reached 95 percent of the Czech GDP, and it is likely to draw level with it."

The Czech Republic has almost twice the population of Slovakia. The above statement, as written, seems quite implausible. Presumably, it was intended to mean that Slovak GDP per capita reached 95% of the Czech GDP per capita. But it doesn't actually say that.Lathamibird (talk) 06:09, 2 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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"Violated the agreement" in Background[edit]

The article states: "Czech and Slovak representatives signed the Pittsburgh Agreement, which promised a common state consisting of two equal nations.... Soon afterward, (Masaryk) and Edvard Beneš violated the agreement by pushing for greater unity and a single nation...Some Slovaks were not in favour of that change, and in March 1939, ..." The claim "violated the agreement" (which I underlined) seems rather strong, and is not explicitly mentioned in History of Czechoslovakia. Is this universally acknowledged, or a controversial interpretation that should a) be toned down, or b) at least sourced? Martinp (talk) 16:11, 10 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@ 176.219.136.164 (talk) 23:15, 20 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
There having been no comments here in over 2 months, I went ahead and reworded to focus on the underlying trends rather than who may or may not have "violated the agreement", which apart from being unsourced is not terribly relevant for a brief background section here. I make no pretense to having expertise here and improvements or reversion are welcome. However, while the dissolution was calm, I think we should be careful of interpretations and editorializing precisely who did what and with what legitimacy 100+ years ago, and include it only if we find appropriate sourcing in reputable secondary sources. And I think that as an editorial matter, such a discussion would belong better in History of Czechoslovakia. Martinp (talk) 13:50, 21 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]
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